[Mk2] [Turbo] MR2 Turbo vs Impreza Turbo?!

[dellams]

Ok, how about we throw the evo into the mix?

Scooby vs MR2 vs Evo vs RX8?

Started reading that evo big head post, 23 pages!! Jeez, I havent got THAT much time to spare! Couldnt say I have had any bad experiences with them, the few I have seen are just pottering about doing family stuff I guess?

The only cars that have tried to waste me are MG's, mazda's and Golf GTI's.

Naturally, I creamed all of them!

The GTI didn't do too bad, but towards the higher end (around 80ish) I started to pull ahead, just didn't seem to have as much power at the top end....

Saw a aston martin the other day, think it was a DB7 or something, was going to chase him but some idiot in a Vauxhall decided to get in the way and thought would do a better job at chasing him then me so I lost him.

Why do they do that?! Hog the outside lane? Make room for a real car and get feck out the way!!

[luthor1]

EVEO's are virtually identical to scoobies. On Top gear they did Scooby -vs- evo vii, they were the same. The only faster ones are the FQ-series which are very quick.

Fugly and expensive, so not personally my bag.

I raced a 225 RX-8 in my 180bhp Cupra Leon and he couldn't pull anything on any straight, those RX engines are rubbish without a turbo they have no torque, I'd pull up on him at the beginning of a gear and he'd stretch it at the end then we'd change and it'd all happen again. I think he'd have had me in the bends quite easily but wasn't pushing, I could see his car had more in it than I had in mine IYSWIM

[dellams]

Yeah they are pretty close. What are the FQ ones putting out then?

And what are the stock evos putting out? Im guess between 225-250 and weigh about the same as a scooby?

So you think the 2 would have no problem beating a RX8 on a straight but would lost on the corners? Which is basically what would happen with a evo and a scooby too.

[Aidy]

And what are the stock evos putting out? Im guess between 225-250 and weigh about the same as a scooby?

Since the V (or since the IV I think) a standard evo has 280PS but the actual power can vary up to as much as maybe even 300 BHP, depends on each car.

The FQs are 300 minimum and go up to 360, with the VIII having an FQ400. The power is in the name, FQ300 etc etc.

[Scotster]

And what are the stock evos putting out? Im guess between 225-250 and weigh about the same as a scooby?

Since the V (or since the IV I think) a standard evo has 280PS but the actual power can vary up to as much as maybe even 300 BHP, depends on each car.

The FQs are 300 minimum and go up to 360, with the VIII having an FQ400. The power is in the name, FQ300 etc etc.

The Evo's have been 276ish bhp since the Evo IV They have had the same engines in and just tweaked them a bit with different injectors etc. When they brought out the VIII they went soft and brought out a lesser 260bhp model (approx the same as the III)

The VIII range was 260, 280... FQ's.. 300, 320, 340, 400 with the 340 being rated the best due to the unbelievable turbo lag on the 400 and the servicing costs. The 340 could be taken to 400 with minimum fuss and none of the drawbacks.

The IX brought out a FQ360 version and the first version of the evo with leather. Not heard much about this one though, sounds the perfect compromise while keeping the warranty.
Scott =op

[dellams]

Seem a bit more than the scooby's then? Although I know some scoobys are pretty powerful at stock too.

So put a rev3 stock, a scooby stock (same year as tubby), a evo stock (same year again) and a rx8 on a drag strip, whos going to win?

[Scotster]

Seem a bit more than the scooby's then? Although I know some scoobys are pretty powerful at stock too.

So put a rev3 stock, a scooby stock (same year as tubby), a evo stock (same year again) and a rx8 on a drag strip, whos going to win?

RX8 will be last, Evo and Rev3 will tussle for first with the Scoob coming in 3rd i would say.

Transmission losses on the 4wd cars is just silly. When i first got my 2 it felt wayyyy faster than my Evo, after 60 though . Up till around 100mph the 4wd cars really are in their element.

Standard rev3 will pull 60 in 5.1, Evo will manage it in around 4.8 (IV, V and VI only unless you go into the 320+ FQ) the 60-100 pull is won by the Rev3 though probably because of the tranny losses.

A standard non P1 scoob will manage 60 in around 5.4 so it shouldn't really be in the game although the imports and the P1 manage around the same as the Evo. Oh, just remembered, i think the older scoob's <2000 manage 60 in 5.1 coz they were a bit lighter.

Cheers

Scott =op

[Aidy]

Various inaccuracies I won't clear up as this isn't an evo forum

Again you seem to think power/weight is everything in all situations. You forget (as many do) the gearing on evos being much shorter than most cars. That's why their performance outweighs their paper stats. As for on-track, forget it. 4wd every time

[jimGTS]

what are 1/4 miles times on scoobs and evos?

[Scotster]

with 300bhp around 13.5 with a great start and driver. Older models are a little quicker. I think the fastest out the box for less than 300 was my old car, evo 5 rs. Had lightened everything and i think the standing quarter was around 13.4 standard. Had funny gearing in it too. Top speed was 137 off the rev limiter lol.

Aidy were all fed up with you talking nonsense. As i have said, i've been there and bought the teeshirt. The evo's are geared for up to a ton. They are good at that but unless tuned they ain't great. The mr2 punches well above its weight in a straight line proved many a time on the quarter. A rev 1 can manage 14.2 stock. Stick in an extra 80 horses and i wouldn't bet against it.

Oh as for track, the supra takes the p1$$ out of 4wd cars including gtr's never mind evo's as seen on many jap test video's. Evo doesn't even rate on the track compared to others out there. The nsx even got shown up by the sup. Think the 2 came 3rd or 4th in the same vid and it was the lowest powered.

Scott

[Aidy]

Aidy were all fed up with you talking nonsense.

Like I said, I'm not going to correct you as it doesn't really matter. If you want this to drag out to another tedious thread then keep on posting cr4p and telling me *I'm* wrong and we'll get there.

Oh as for track, the supra takes the p1$$ out of 4wd cars

Ok, you've had your fun...now back on topic.

[dellams]

Wheres this video? I would love to watch it! The supra rear wheel drive too? How comes it sticks on the corners better than a 4wd car then?

Cant remember what Supras put out? At least 300bhp I think?

Better add it to the drag strip:

Start:

MR2
Supra
Scooby
Evo
RX8

Im guessing finish would be:

MR2
Supra
Evo
Scooby
RX8

[luthor1]

At a recent trackday, my MR2 had nothing-special tyres, and is running around 270bhp. I was not suffering wheelspin excessively at all, so I don't see how at that sort of power level 4WD would be any advantage. Infact it adds weight!

The CoG on the 4WD cars is much higher too.

NOTE WELL: 4WD DOES NOT MAKE THE TYRES ANY MORE STICKY THAN THEY ALREADY ARE - YOU WON'T PULL HIGHER LATERAL G AT APEX JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE 4WD.

This is the biggest misunderstanding. Suddenly when it's raining, people think because they have 4WD they can throw the car around roundabouts. Why think this? Just because your front wheels are driven aswell as the rears doesn't add lateral grip to your car! All it will do is improve the apex-to-exit time but ONLY when 2WD would wheelspin.

[dellams]

doh!

Stupid thing didnt preserve my spacing! The actual order I tried to put was:

Supra
MR2
Evo
Scooby
RX8

[dellams]

At a recent trackday, my MR2 had nothing-special tyres, and is running around 270bhp. I was not suffering wheelspin excessively at all, so I don't see how at that sort of power level 4WD would be any advantage. Infact it adds weight!

The CoG on the 4WD cars is much higher too.

NOTE WELL: 4WD DOES NOT MAKE THE TYRES ANY MORE STICKY THAN THEY ALREADY ARE - YOU WON'T PULL HIGHER LATERAL G AT APEX JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE 4WD.

This is the biggest misunderstanding. Suddenly when it's raining, people think because they have 4WD they can throw the car around roundabouts. Why think this? Just because your front wheels are driven aswell as the rears doesn't add lateral grip to your car! All it will do is improve the apex-to-exit time but ONLY when 2WD would wheelspin.

true, true, good point mate!

[Aidy]

I don't see how at that sort of power level 4WD would be any advantage.

It increases available traction.

Infact it adds weight!

I think we're all aware of the downsides od awd

The CoG on the 4WD cars is much higher too.

Why?

YOU WON'T PULL HIGHER LATERAL G AT APEX JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE 4WD.

Correct, however if driving fast is all about lateral G why doesn't every car on the same tyres put in the same laptimes? The most lateral G you'll get from sporty tyres is about 1.0 - 1.2. As you say, that is regardless of the car.

When we did the car limits course my old VI was 3 seconds quicker than an MR2T which was 1s quicker than my MR2 NA. Same driver, same track, same day.

End of discussion

[luthor1]

A.I.D.Y, everything you say is inaccurate in some form or another.

"It increases traction" - hence I used the caveat 'whilst I'm not wheel-spinning'

"Why is CoG higher" - because 4WD cars have more weight higher from the ground? I'm not sure why you are asking this question - it's blatantly obvious and yet again shows your complete blindness to ovbious FACT.

You last ridiculous paragraph - the same driver will not necessarily get 100% out of a different style car mate, I may be be very good in a RWD MR2, but give me a clio williams and I'll have no idea how to make a FWD car work. You have proven NOTHING yet again, and used a very aggressive "end of discussion " to put the back up of everyone who reads your words.

Go for a re-boot and get some algorithm upgrades, the only thing for you here is contradiction. We won't agree with you for an easy life, if you continue to conjure up non-sense I will continue to point out the facts.

Bring on the discussion

[Aidy]

"It increases traction" - hence I used the caveat 'whilst I'm not wheel-spinning'

You can make more use of the power you have.

"Why is CoG higher" - because 4WD cars have more weight higher from the ground?

Why?

I'm not sure why you are asking this question - it's blatantly obvious

You'll be able to explain then, won't you?

the same driver will not necessarily get 100% out of a different style car mate

It was Andy Walsh driving, I think he knows what he is doing. His main weapon of choice is actually the Elise, about as far from an evo as you'd get.

You have proven NOTHING yet again

All you're doing is talking hypothetically. I had a pro driver in my evo and in an MR2T on the same track, same day and the evo was 3 seconds faster. You're saying that doesn't prove anything? Could you please explain to me what *would* prove that evos are faster than mr2s?

I strongly suspect nothing would as you don't want to admit to the truth.

[Tiamat]

Aidy, Luthor1 - why bother?
You clearly not going to agree and putting "FACT" or "END OF DISCUSSION" after a post isn't going to change a single thing.
Why not leave it or take it to a PM where you can argue to your hearts content.
You're both going around in circles, neither of you proving anything.
This thread is not subject to moderation, nor is there any intention to, but you have completely dominated it away from what was intended.
If you two going to argue like this, why not start your own thread and allow other people the ability to discuss the issues and put forth their opinions instead of stalking each other across the forum.

[Aidy]

Why not leave it or take it to a PM

And rob the general population of why 4wd means more weight higher from the ground

If that was a "STFU or get moderated" then I'll take the hint