N/A mk1 - can it be turbo'd?

[feral4mr2]

So how much power is John's engine producing? Answer = LOTS!

nowhere as much as i would like man...
even with this current 4age based engine, if i had an aftermarket engine management set-up to be able to tune it, i know i could gain more than it does now with the gze ECU. the engine is tired though after the constant flogging (and so it should be) but still goes strong. would have to think at 12psi it would have to be up around the 180 - 200 rwhp mark, but thats just an excited guess.

i'll have to get it on a dyno with 12psi before i kill it just for interest sake sometime. i've only ever had it on the dyno not too long after i rebuilt the engine with a low 7psi, produced a pleaseing 142 rwhp.

i have been thinking of getting some second hand nissan ca18det 83mm forged pistons and rebuilding my old 4agze engine with a 83mm bore and my turbo set-up. could be interesting.

[mr2mk1chick]

been away all weekend (UCS) and just read all replies now.
In my heart i know that a conversion/new engine 2l turbo is prob the best option, but wanted to try something perhaps cheaper in the interim.
Im not sure how solid my engine is tho' to take the extra power. (suppose i don't know if i don't try - but will maybe dyno it first to see what it is running and compression test it etc)
been looking a bit on the 2brutal site also, and got some ideas and slowly starting to understand a very little bit about the engines.
Basically if i change the manifold, put turbo on, and different pistons (lower compression), ecu/chip change, thats it?

someone list me a shopping list so i get the whole (simple?!) picture:

[Lauren]

been away all weekend (UCS) and just read all replies now.
In my heart i know that a conversion/new engine 2l turbo is prob the best option, but wanted to try something perhaps cheaper in the interim.
Im not sure how solid my engine is tho' to take the extra power. (suppose i don't know if i don't try - but will maybe dyno it first to see what it is running and compression test it etc)
been looking a bit on the 2brutal site also, and got some ideas and slowly starting to understand a very little bit about the engines.
Basically if i change the manifold, put turbo on, and different pistons (lower compression), ecu/chip change, thats it?

someone list me a shopping list so i get the whole (simple?!) picture:

Jo you could just run with stock pistons and lower boost, it'd still make the car plenty quick enough.

what you need:
Turbo manifold (hint, hint!)
downpipe
turbo - hybrid no doubt
intercooler
Dastek/unichop
oil feed&return/pipes for oil supply
MAP sensor that can measure boost
bigger injectors
uprated fuel press regulator

And new SC pistons if you wanted to go for higher boost. Of course this would really end up being a bottom end rebuild at least as you invariably can't do one thing wihout doing another. It becomes a 'whilst you are there' scenario.

[feral4mr2]

[Jo you could just run with stock pistons and lower boost, it'd still make the car plenty quick enough.

for sure, anyone that tells you that you NEED lower c/r forged pistons still thinks the earth is flat.
i only lowered my c/r because of the engine management i am useing, if i had a tunable set-up i would still have 9.4:1 c/r.

[mr2mk1chick]

cool - thx lauren 4 list
I can maybe start to plan this as a winter project

[Lauren]

cool - thx lauren 4 list
I can maybe start to plan this as a winter project

No worries Jo, JFDI

If you need an uberswan turbo manifold and downpipe i have just the ticket:

[feral4mr2]

mr2mk1chick, shoot me a e-mail if you need any help with the conversion when you start your project.

[waynestoyotamr2]

Lauren, it took you a surprising amount of time to get the turbo manifold advert in!!!

[Lauren]

Lauren, it took you a surprising amount of time to get the turbo manifold advert in!!!

I know, i was biding my time waiting for the exact right moment to place it.

[Icsunonove]

Jo, I've seen that manifold, it really is a work of art! It's really too nice to go on a car, it deserves a place on the mantle piece.

And the problem is a heat shield goes over the top and you can't actually see it when its fitted to the car. Perhaps you could fit some quick release fasteners on it so that when you go to a cruise you can whip it off! (after the exhaust has cooled down obviously )

(It's designed for a Garrett Airesearch T25 turbocharger by the way)

[pistol supercharged pete]

jo
i have here mk1 sc pistons rods etc and intercooler and sc cams which would work nice with a turbo - all came out of mine before i started uputting silly things in it so that are all fine
let me know if your interesed i am sure we can do a deal
pete

[Blokey]

That turbo manifold, etc looks nice. I'd go for turbo'ing over/above supercharging. Not sure what differences rest between the NA/SC engines on a Mk1 but the SC must draw around 30bhp to 40bhp off the engine and I believe they're less efficient at boosting and more efficient at heating up your charge than a turbo charger...

So a TC is more efficient and it doesn't draw so much power off the engine...win win really.

B.

[excalibur1814]

Mk1 Na - 122bhp
Mk1 Sc - 145bhp
Mk1 Levin ae101- 160bhp
Mk1 Levin ae101 with pulley - 174bhp ish



So the sc 'is' a viable power choice. Get yourself an uprated intercooler and heatsoaks not as much of a problem (Especially with good ducting like Laurens):

Brand new from America last month:

[Lauren]

Mk1 Na - 122bhp
Mk1 Sc - 145bhp
Mk1 Levin ae101- 160bhp
Mk1 Levin ae101 with pulley - 174bhp ish



So the sc 'is' a viable power choice. Get yourself an uprated intercooler and heatsoaks not as much of a problem (Especially with good ducting like Laurens):

Brand new from America last month:

Best i had with my Ae92 spec levin engine was 182bhp big pulley etc..

power outputs are all about the same with big pulleys tbh. Its the torque curve that improves on the small port engine.

[Blokey]

....I'm sure the SC is a viable engine - but if you took two engines both producing 200bhp - one boosted via a SC, the other by a TC - wouldn't the 200bhp from the TC engine be placing that engine under less load than the SC bosted engine?

B.

[Lauren]

....I'm sure the SC is a viable engine - but if you took two engines both producing 200bhp - one boosted via a SC, the other by a TC - wouldn't the 200bhp from the TC engine be placing that engine under less load than the SC bosted engine?

B.

Best option tbh is go straight turbo. get a nice 220bhp and put the engine about the same strain as a big pulley'd SC. So it would take it absolutely fine. TC is way too complicated.

[Blokey]

Hi Lauren,
Sorry - I'm accidentally misleading people - I mean turbo it - TC for me is a Turbo Charger, not a Twin Charger...sorry. my mistake.

B.

[Icsunonove]

jo
i have here mk1 sc pistons rods etc and intercooler and sc cams which would work nice with a turbo - all came out of mine before i started uputting silly things in it so that are all fine
let me know if your interesed i am sure we can do a deal
pete

Pete, can I be first reserve if Jo doesn't want them?

What's the exact piston diameter, do you know?

Blokey, I agree with everything you say, but there is one huge benefit with supercharging - the power delivery.

Having said which to supercharge an NA engine is going to be a right game. So if I had an 4AGE and wanted to get a load of power out of it, I would go the turbo route (using 4AGZE pistons)

[feral4mr2]

people have put the 4agze s/c gear onto stock 4age blocks too..

a high comp boosted engine tuned correctly with a good aftermarket engine management system (and someone that knows how to tune it) with good intercooling, fuel etc. will yeild higher torque, better fuel economy and also can produce a higher HP output. dont be afraid of boost and high comp engines..


bah, enough from me. i know what works for me, thats good enough to keep me happy for the present moment in time.

[Icsunonove]

John (the Feral one) you're really asking for it! Be prepared for me to be pestering you all the time for information! Just 'cos you're in Queensland doesn't mean you will get away with it!

What's the difference in cams between GE and GZE, anyone know?

Who wants to sell me a 4AGE then? I want to start the project now!