replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Anything and everything to do with mechanical issues with your Mk2

Moderators: IMOC Moderators, IMOC Committee Members

lower
Posts: 438
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 2:05 pm
Location: Leicester

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by lower »

you're upset that i've questioned your new information? why? that's exactly why this list is here.

look at the rest of this thread. because of the discussion we've had there is now a really good description of how the rear brakes work and the best way to reset the handbrake. far more than a 'just do it my way cos it works and if you don't it won't' type thread.

if you've taken offence to my questioning then i do apologise. but are you suggesting that every mr2 owner out who reads this list goes out to their cars and resets the rear calipers just because they haven't fitted their rear pads using your method? i'm sure there are people out there with a incorrectly functioning handbrake because they've just wound the pads back in. i'm also sure there is a large number of people out there who have used the standard wind back method and had no problems.

for the record, i've been on this list as a mr2 owner for 5 years. i've learnt and contributed a fair amount of information, some of which has helped me, some of which i hope has helped others. i am certainly not the type of person that shoots down new information, neither am i the type of person that accepts things just because someone on here says it without explaining why.
PW@Woodsport
Posts: 7642
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 6:40 pm
Location: durham
Contact:

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by PW@Woodsport »

oh for the love of god!

i havent taken exception to your questioning,it was calling me a bloody scaremonger that offended when i was perfectly right all along!

i gave you a perfect description of how to do it properly many posts ago (as have others) without having to drag me over the coals.



i'm also sure there is a large number of people out there who have used the standard wind back method and had no problems.


this isnt a METHOD at all,its just the WRONG way to do it.....and i never once said that anyone who hadnt used my method should go out and strip their rear brakes down,you are implying something i havent even said.

Even if they did redo the calipers to make sure they were right....why is that a bad thing??? isnt it better to have them working 100% than not at all?

neither am i the type of person that accepts things just because someone on here says it without explaining why.


you're not kidding....

As ive said before,this isnt a hobby,im not just a car enthusiast,i work on mr2's for a living....and anything new that i find out while doing my job i share on the forums,i dont have to do that and i will be taking a back seat when it comes to giving advice from now on,i cant be bothered with the hassle of having to explain each and everytime someone doesnt understand why it should be done that way,ive been an Imoc member since 98 and in that time seen hundreds of ill advised posts on rear brake adjustment (among other things) and said nothing so as not to appear argumentative....you made it very clear two pages ago that i was talking nonsense and that my way of doing it was wrong,even after i went into specific detail on how the internal mechanism works you still had issue with me (and other members testaments that this is how its done).....you can keep your half hearted "if you've taken offence" apology mate ,you insulted me by calling me a scaremonger.....well i wont be "scaremongering" anymore on this forum so theres nothing for you to worry about.
Image
PW@Woodsport
Posts: 7642
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 6:40 pm
Location: durham
Contact:

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by PW@Woodsport »

just re-read your post....


i'm sure there are people out there with a incorrectly functioning handbrake because they've just wound the pads back in


and then in the next sentence....


i'm also sure there is a large number of people out there who have used the standard wind back method and had no problems


Note the word LARGE present in the second sentence but not in the first implying you think more people wont have a problem just doing it your incorrect way than if its done by the book??? crazy.

but hey what do i care,i wont be advising in future.
Image
lower
Posts: 438
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 2:05 pm
Location: Leicester

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by lower »

Paul,

enough. i have re-read the whole thread, and cannot see where at any point i have said that your method was wrong or would not work. i have asked you to explain it, which you have. i have thought about it and posted an explanation of why your method works. i have at no point said your method will not work and have said on a number of occasions that your method is better and i will use it myself next time i do my brakes.

the simple wind back is a method. it is the method in the toyota manual. granted, you may have problems with the handbrake if you don't reset the pistons your way. you continually state that this method doesn't work at all.

where i have disagreed with you is where you have stated that if you use the wind back method, your handbrake will not work because that is not the case. that is the only thing you have said that i have disagree with.

you yourself have stated you used to do the simple wind back method until you learnt your current one and i'm sure you didn't send cars out with a handbrake that didn't work.

anyway, i'm going to leave this post here as we are unlikely to agree.


Paul Woods wrote:oh for the love of god!

i havent taken exception to your questioning,it was calling me a bloody scaremonger that offended when i was perfectly right all along!

i gave you a perfect description of how to do it properly many posts ago (as have others) without having to drag me over the coals.



i'm also sure there is a large number of people out there who have used the standard wind back method and had no problems.


this isnt a METHOD at all,its just the WRONG way to do it.....and i never once said that anyone who hadnt used my method should go out and strip their rear brakes down,you are implying something i havent even said.

Even if they did redo the calipers to make sure they were right....why is that a bad thing??? isnt it better to have them working 100% than not at all?

neither am i the type of person that accepts things just because someone on here says it without explaining why.


you're not kidding....

As ive said before,this isnt a hobby,im not just a car enthusiast,i work on mr2's for a living....and anything new that i find out while doing my job i share on the forums,i dont have to do that and i will be taking a back seat when it comes to giving advice from now on,i cant be bothered with the hassle of having to explain each and everytime someone doesnt understand why it should be done that way,ive been an Imoc member since 98 and in that time seen hundreds of ill advised posts on rear brake adjustment (among other things) and said nothing so as not to appear argumentative....you made it very clear two pages ago that i was talking nonsense and that my way of doing it was wrong,even after i went into specific detail on how the internal mechanism works you still had issue with me (and other members testaments that this is how its done).....you can keep your half hearted "if you've taken offence" apology mate ,you insulted me by calling me a scaremonger.....well i wont be "scaremongering" anymore on this forum so theres nothing for you to worry about.
PW@Woodsport
Posts: 7642
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 6:40 pm
Location: durham
Contact:

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by PW@Woodsport »

mate its the scaremonger name calling i have a problem with,not your bloody piston winding "method"....do what you like on that score,but dont ever call me names again,i hope ive made myself clear.

From now on i will keep my advice to myself.
Image
JJ
Posts: 3825
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:11 am
Location: Stockton-On-Tees

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by JJ »

but hey what do i care,i wont be advising in future.


Rubbish, I won't accept that ! Paul, people will always challenge you at some point, hey I've had loads of people that disagree with me, but occasionally they come round to my thinking.

Lower, perhaps lighten up on the thorough nit picking .. its not required and not board friendly. This thread is spiralling into frustration between you both over what ??? a daft mechanism ? You show hostility within your words for a simple correction / challenge to the discussion. Rise as you will, however your only showing yourself up.

regards.

the shrink. :mrgreen:
|| S256SX Airwerks Powered MR2 Turbo || V10 BMW M5 ||
lower
Posts: 438
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 2:05 pm
Location: Leicester

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by lower »

good point. my words are not intended to be hostile.

Paul, if i've offended you with the scaremongering comment then i appologise unconditionally. i do not want to be the cause of you not offering advice on the board as it is beneficial.

i still think that the first part of this thread was a worthwhile exercise. there's some good solid technical info in that that should go in the knowledge base that would be not be around if we hadn't discussed it.



JJ wrote:
but hey what do i care,i wont be advising in future.



Lower, perhaps lighten up on the thorough nit picking .. its not required and not board friendly. This thread is spiralling into frustration between you both over what ??? a daft mechanism ? You show hostility within your words for a simple correction / challenge to the discussion. Rise as you will, however your only showing yourself up.

regards.

the shrink. :mrgreen:
JohnnyC
Posts: 7001
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:25 pm
Location: West Yorkshire

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by JohnnyC »

Certainly not wanting to reopen this can of worms :mrgreen: but I replaced my rear discs/pads and I simply could not unwind the piston 180 degrees back out as there simply wasn't the clearance for the pads after doing so :-k Had to settle for just less than a quarter turn.

Reckon I got lucky though as my handbrake is actually miles better now than it was, infact braking in general is much improved (and they haven't even bedded in yet) - they made a bigger difference than replacing the completely worn fronts last weekend.
PW@Woodsport
Posts: 7642
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 6:40 pm
Location: durham
Contact:

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by PW@Woodsport »

can open...worms all over the place... every mr2 caliper will wind back out 180 degs its just that you have to take it in the appropriate amount first before winding out...simply winding them all the way back may not allow you to get them 180 back out as you have discovered.Hard to explain but i will try....imagine your piston is a clock face with the two slots pointing at 12 and 6,now for explanation just focus on the one thats pointing at 12 oclock on a fully wound in piston,now you wind it back out so that this point is now pointing at 6...180 degs right? but you cant get the caliper over the pads,correct? now what you do is take the piston back in so that its wound past its starting point to say 10 or 11 oclock,now wind it back out and it will let you wind 180degs and still fit over the pads.......christ thats hard to explain,but bottom line is if you wind all the way in,and back out 180 and you cant fit the caliper then take it all the way back in to your starting point and then add some,if that still doesnt work then repeat adding more wind in each time until it does fit over the caliper......now shoo worms,back in your tin.
Image
robwsurf
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 7:38 pm
Location: leeds uk

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by robwsurf »

not this again! you'd if it didnt work the way they had done it, its at least worth trying the way suggested! especially from someone who is pretty much a mr2 expert!

or strip you calipers down and work it out for yourselves
JohnnyC
Posts: 7001
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:25 pm
Location: West Yorkshire

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by JohnnyC »

Paul, that's broke my brain :lol:

I realise that the piston has to end up at 12/6 o clock for the sunken in bits to fit around the back of the pad that sticks out. But the piston, when turned anti-clockwise - starts coming out straight away. And I'd been turning clockwise so that the piston wasn't going in any further.

I guess my pads are too fat :mrgreen: Was considering losing the anti-squeal shims on the inner pads but as I'd just paid £10.74 for them that wasn't an option :D

Anyway, I recommend everyone to at least attempt to unwind 180 degrees as it's the proper way :thumleft:

Disappointed that my rear pads didn't have the holes in them for the anti-squeal springs though (the springs aren't in the BGB either for rears, but are in the Toyota EPC :-k ).
crazylegs
Posts: 2811
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 4:13 pm
Location: Wiltshire

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by crazylegs »

bottom line here is do you want your brakes to work ? if so use pauls method it works EVERY time. if you think you know better than a man who has forgotten more than i will ever know try a different method .it might work, it might leave you with crap or no hand brake.
i quite like my brakes to work,i dont think thats too crazy,i also am a bit lazy so i use the every time method.feel free to spend all day taking the brakes off and trying again and again to get a bit stop on your hand brake.just dont ask me to help!
PW@Woodsport
Posts: 7642
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 6:40 pm
Location: durham
Contact:

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by PW@Woodsport »

But the piston, when turned anti-clockwise - starts coming out straight away
ah ha!! thats just it johnny! it doesnt! even when you wind it all the way back,if you wind it back out 180,caliper wont fit over pads,so you take it back in 180 plus another 20 or 30 degrees...now i know the piston wont go back any further but it now wont start coming back out until you have passed the extra 20 or 30 degrees you gave it.

I swear this will work for you,your pads are not too thick,try it again following the steps below.....very hard to explain.

1)slacken off h'brake cable under floor
2)wind piston right in
3)fit pads
4)wind piston out 180 so slot is aligned with pad lug
5)try to fit caliper
6)if it wont fit over the pads take the piston all the way back in and then add another 1/8th of a turn (45 degs)
7)now wind back out 180 so that lugs are aligned again
8)repeat this adding more degrees to step 6 until the caliper is a nice fit over the pads
9)pump footbrake
10)take up the h/brake cable slack until the lever is on 3 or 4 clicks.

Im off for a lie down.
Image
JohnnyC
Posts: 7001
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:25 pm
Location: West Yorkshire

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by JohnnyC »

crazylegs wrote:bottom line here is do you want your brakes to work ? if so use pauls method it works EVERY time. if you think you know better than a man who has forgotten more than i will ever know try a different method .it might work, it might leave you with crap or no hand brake.

I wasn't doubting the Pauls advice, it's very much appreciated - just mentioned the problem I had trying to do it right.
JohnnyC
Posts: 7001
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:25 pm
Location: West Yorkshire

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by JohnnyC »

Paul Woods wrote:ah ha!! thats just it johnny! it doesnt! even when you wind it all the way back,if you wind it back out 180,caliper wont fit over pads,so you take it back in 180 plus another 20 or 30 degrees...now i know the piston wont go back any further but it now wont start coming back out until you have passed the extra 20 or 30 degrees you gave it.

Ahhh, now that's very useful info, I didn't know that.
Top advice as always Paul, cheers :thumleft:
chris99
Posts: 151
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2005 2:04 pm
Location: Harrogate

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by chris99 »

This thread is so pointless. What a bunch of girls :lol: :lol: :lol:

I am going to copy any usefull info onto my PC so when i change my rear pads i wont have to re read all that crap! all 4 pages of it :roll:

Paul,

Dont be upset about all this matey! I have only been on this site for a short time but i already trust your advise. I respect your opinion on all things MR2. It would be a real shame if you stopped helping others now as that means you wouldnt be able to help me when i ask dumb questions :mrgreen:

Lower,

Chill out!! If you are happy and it works for you then thats great. Thanks for giving another viewpoint on the subject. At least people can read throught this thread and make their own mind up about how they want to do it. 8)


At the end of the day at least now we all know how the rear brake system works now =D> =D> =D>
W0mbat

...

Post by W0mbat »

i haven't read all the posts but...

i changed my rear pads, simply took the top off the brake fluid reservoir, used the lil tool to wind the piston into the calipers, changed the pads, whacked the caplipers back on, pumped the brake pedal a few times until hrad, popped the brake fluid reservoir cap back on and off i went.

worked a treat. handbrake is perfect.
snarf
Posts: 38
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 9:26 pm
Location: Banbury Oxon

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by snarf »

I'm in the process of replacing my rear discs and pads and have browsed through this thread and taken most of it in but missed the bit about a tool to turn the piston in with. Do i need a special tool for this or not? #-o
JohnnyC
Posts: 7001
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:25 pm
Location: West Yorkshire

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by JohnnyC »

You can use an open ended spanner - preferably with the ring type at the other end so you can stick a screwdriver through to give you the leverage to turn it.
Halfords have a tool, but it's £20, I bought it but TBH don't think it's worth it.
snarf
Posts: 38
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 9:26 pm
Location: Banbury Oxon

Re: replaced rear pads- but handbrake now rubbish!

Post by snarf »

yeah thanks, but still gonna be tricky trying to hold caliper still and doing that, unless i'm missing something here #-o
Post Reply

Return to “Mechanical”