Help need !!!!! NOW WITH PICS LOOKY LOOKY

[toxo]

Christ, not the cat / no cat argument again?! This has been covered *so* many times!

General rule of thumb goes like this (there are exceptions - I have generalized):
If your car is a post 1992 N/A, it *has* to have a cat.
If your car is a post 1994 turbo, it *has* to have a cat.

Any car listed above that passes with a decat has been mis-tested and your MOT tester is either lazy, an idiot, or thinks he is doing you a favour.

[pcp]

Christ, not the cat / no cat argument again?! This has been covered *so* many times!

General rule of thumb goes like this (there are exceptions - I have generalized):
If your car is a post 1992 N/A, it *has* to have a cat.
If your car is a post 1994 turbo, it *has* to have a cat.

Any car listed above that passes with a decat has been mis-tested and your MOT tester is either lazy, an idiot, or thinks he is doing you a favour.

where does it say that a catalytic converter has to be present?

[toxo]

Nowhere in the MOT testers handbook does it say that you have to have a cat. However you will never ever pass the predefined emissions targets as set in the VOSA emissions book for the SW20/3SGE combination, nor the more stringent targets set for chassis and engine combinations sold outside of the UK after 1995 without a catalytic converter.

The targets cars are required to meet are much more lenient if they either pre '92 or pre '95 and never met type approval in this country, which is why if your car falls into either of these categories you can pass without a cat. I seem to remember they allow about 4x the emissions in that case.

[pcp]

Nowhere in the MOT testers handbook does it say that you have to have a cat. However you will never ever pass the predefined emissions targets as set in the VOSA emissions book for the SW20/3SGE combination, nor the more stringent targets set for chassis and engine combinations sold outside of the UK after 1995 without a catalytic converter.

The targets cars are required to meet are much more lenient if they either pre '92 or pre '95 and never met type approval in this country, which is why if your car falls into either of these categories you can pass without a cat. I seem to remember they allow about 4x the emissions in that case.

Mine passed with a decat pipe, and it's all automated over here, only way to fool the computer into allowing the test to continue would be to stick the gauge in a car with a cat, i'm not trying to start an argument but from personal experience you can legally pass without a cat

[toxo]

I'm interested - also not trying to start an argument Did they give you an emissions sheet with your MOT cert? It should say what they tested the car as and what values it passed with. I've got a pass from my MOT in 2007 when the car still had a cat, where the testing garage entered the car into the automated system incorrectly and tested it as a 3SGE. I've also got a fail sheet from a test in 2008 with no cat which was tested as a 3SGE (which it obviously would).

Edit: Out of interest, has your car had an engine change? Sorry this has wandered a bit off topic

[pcp]

I'm interested - also not trying to start an argument Did they give you an emissions sheet with your MOT cert? It should say what they tested the car as and what values it passed with. I've got a pass from my MOT in 2007 when the car still had a cat, where the testing garage entered the car into the automated system incorrectly and tested it as a 3SGE. I've also got a fail sheet from a test in 2008 with no cat which was tested as a 3SGE (which it obviously would).

Edit: Out of interest, has your car had an engine change? Sorry this has wandered a bit off topic

No change just apexi air filter and mongoose with decat. yep they give you a breakdown of the results, god knows where it is tho, i posted the results up here after my MOT, i'll see if i can find them

edit: found it http://www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic. ... hlight=mot

altho just looking through the regs he should've tested both pipes and averaged them, he only tested one, maybe the other one is like a power plant

[toxo]

There was a thread here somewhere about twin exit exhausts having a 'favourite' side as it were, due to the design and the way the gasses flow through them

I don't have the specific figures to hand for the 3SGE but the default limits are certainly 0.3% CO and 200ppm HC at ~2750rpm, compared to what my turbo has to pass which is 3.5% CO and 1200ppm HC! Turbo engines have cleaner emissions than nasps too...

[pcp]

There was a thread here somewhere about twin exit exhausts having a 'favourite' side as it were, due to the design and the way the gasses flow through them

I don't have the specific figures to hand for the 3SGE but the default limits are certainly 0.3% CO and 200ppm HC at ~2750rpm, compared to what my turbo has to pass which is 3.5% CO and 1200ppm HC! Turbo engines have cleaner emissions than nasps too...

do you not sleep?

[toxo]

Not really no I am actually still at work, have been here since about half 9 yesterday morning. But I'm waiting for something to finish and watching progress bars so I entertain myself by messing around on the Internet.

[Slarty]

Pfft, sleep is for wimps

Ps it's post july '95 for the cat requirement

[pcp]

Pfft, sleep is for wimps

Ps it's post july '95 for the cat requirement

saturday and sunday mornings are for sleeping

[toxo]

Ps it's post july '95 for the cat requirement

I did say I was generalising I'm guessing from that and the age of your car that you've had "the argument" though right?

[daz364]

Thanks for that information guys got nearly eveything off ill post some pics when its off just struggling with the cat brackets that bolt ontoeach side they are unbolted from the side it is all loose but the 2 side brackets are holding it in and with the cat in i cant get to the bolts properly anybody got any tips failing that ill cut em off and get some more has anyone got any lying around anywhere they want to get rid off it would be apreciated

Many thanks to everyones input Daz

[Dale_V]

the side bolts are a pain, I got them of by using a pipe wrench, as they had rounded off so much that i couldnt get a normal spanner on them.

cut them off if you need to

[daz364]

Right guys iv managed to get the cat gutted how ever does anyone know if i need the sensor in the bottom of the cat on a rev 3 as its totalled

Thanks daz

[Leon.]

some people will tell you that you have to have a cat for the mot, but you don't, mine passed with a decat, just depends on how healthy your engine is i guess

With an N/A it's likely to be a fair bit easier than with a turbo and a big bore exhaust. I have a very healthy engine, but get nowhere near the requirement.

[pcp]

some people will tell you that you have to have a cat for the mot, but you don't, mine passed with a decat, just depends on how healthy your engine is i guess

With an N/A it's likely to be a fair bit easier than with a turbo and a big bore exhaust. I have a very healthy engine, but get nowhere near the requirement.

i thought turbos generally had lower emmisions?