TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

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Icsunonove
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by Icsunonove »

Neil,

If it really is that bad let me know. If you need a complete 3S-GTE engine there is a second hand one available in Derby. It's currently at a scrap yard but has been purchased by someone who simply intends to sell it on.

I know this because I have bought the rear anti-roll bar and fitted it to my Mk1 to try and dial out the understeer on trackdays.
tonigmr2
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by tonigmr2 »

Bl00dy h3ll mate, fingers crossed for you...
T
jonno
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by jonno »

Heard from Bri this afternoon - bad news, its definitely the block cracked in cylinder 2. 90psi compression, but the leakdown test at TDC was perfect, until the piston is moved about half way down the bore then it pressurised the coolant and antifreeze goes everywhere!.

The good news is that the pistons and rings seem fine, which should mean that I just need to source a thick walled block and re-assemble the engine. Not a trivial task but alot cheaper than rebuilding from scratch!.

I guess it serves as a warning to those pushing the stock internals - be careful out there, this stuff isnt as strong as you think :)
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Icsunonove
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by Icsunonove »

Neil,

Have just got back from Powerhouse. Never heard of them or been there before. I had been tipped off that he had a Mk1 Supercharger engine (4AGZE). Turns out it isn't, it's just got Supercharger cam covers on it, never mind!

Bri was working on your car and I had a good look round it.

Your car looks great, hope you can source a thick walled block cheaply :shock:

I told Bri that there was an engine available in Derby but he said it is no good because you need a thick walled block.

If you are going to any trackdays, can I book myself as a passenger for a couple of laps?

Best of luck, Tom
paul port
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by paul port »

For Reference...
A Brand New Toyota Short-block costs 732.39 + vat
And that's with Crank, Rods and Pistons...

I would guess the block alone would be ~500 odd...

Always worth asking your Toyota dealer before looking outside..

Paul
Mikejc
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by Mikejc »

That really is very bad news to here Neil, I feel for you mate :cry: I hate hearing these storys truth be told because as you know i'm still running on standard internals and hearing the above makes me feel that i'm living with borrowed time until the Big Bang comes my way! :( I'm actually amazed that its not happened yet given the figures now being reached !?

Only a matter of time i'm sure 8-[

Best of luck with the rebuild buddy and I hope you make it along to TOTB [-o<

My own car should be ready in time for the event but I very much doubt that i'll have any time spare to get some proof runs in over the 1/4! Will keep you posted :wink:

Mikejc
jonno
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by jonno »

Icsunonove wrote:I had been tipped off that he had a Mk1 Supercharger engine (4AGZE). Turns out it isn't, it's just got Supercharger cam covers on it, never mind!


I dont think your the first person to assume that was a 4AGZE! Bri sometimes seems slightly eccentric, but its my experience that all the best mechanics are slightly mad - he is one of the best :)

Icsunonove wrote:If you are going to any trackdays, can I book myself as a passenger for a couple of laps?


No problem Tom, I usually like to do the first 5 or 10 laps on my own, after that I tend to go looking for passengers :)
Last edited by jonno on Tue May 24, 2005 7:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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jonno
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by jonno »

paul port wrote:For Reference...
A Brand New Toyota Short-block costs 732.39 + vat
And that's with Crank, Rods and Pistons...

I would guess the block alone would be ~500 odd...


If only it were that simple! - From what I hear Toyota are still producing and selling the thin walled blocks. It seems to be very hit and miss depdnding on the casting process how thick the walls actually are. This means I need to buy the block before I can test it. Luckily both Fensport and Fraser will sell a 100% thick walled block that they test before selling it to you.

My next dillema is... should I re-used my existing CP 86.5mm pistons or use some 86mm pistons so I dont need to bore the new block?

Neil.
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JJ
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by JJ »

For the price of pistons at the moment, I'd go for the stock sized 86.00mm. You need new rings anyway, they'll set you back £100 ish... machining the block say £100, then buy the block £500 - £700.

Either way, for the price of the rings and the machine work, its seems more feasible to go and get a new set of pistons - that way, the wall stays the thickest possible !

Such a shame jonno :cry: I best be wise with my block - best double check mine come to think of it since my TOTB episode .. I migh have a hairline crack in mine without knowing it ! :shock:
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stevecordiner
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by stevecordiner »

Why not have a look at sourcing a late spec 5SFE block from the US and converting it for turbo purposes e.g. oil feed and then external oil cooler. They have a higher silicon (IIRC) content and are thicker. Know it'd be a serious delay, but could be worth considering. Fonzy would be able to give you more info on the issues with running a 5SFE block.

Just a thought fella!

Steve
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MR2Mania
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by MR2Mania »

For Reference...
A Brand New Toyota Short-block costs 732.39 + vat
And that's with Crank, Rods and Pistons...


Paul, you wouldn't happen to know the part nos for those prices, would you?
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V8Killer
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by V8Killer »

Jonno...

gutted for ya. Just been away to Monaco for the weekend and you do this!!! Yes Fraser / Fensport will definately sell you a 100% thick walled block (brand new). Am not sure how Fraser does it, but i got it ultrasonically tested anyway and came out thick. Fensport get there blocks tested from the same bloke who is building my engine, so its 100%.

Your best bet is to use 86.00 mm pistons if you are doing it again. If your pushing big boost on a mid / large turbo you really want the thickest walls possible. I can see now why my engine builder refused to build me an engine with the new thick walled block and 86.50 mm pistons.

Hope you get it back together asap...

Muhsin

PS: Who is rebuilding it?
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Mikejc
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by Mikejc »

Sorry to ask a Q on the back of your thread Neil but it's all to relevant to miss the chance......... Given my own cars spec (please see profile) am I asking for trouble given the fact that i'm running 1.3 bar with standard internals, ie is it a matter of time before BANG SHE GOES !?

Mikejc
V8Killer
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by V8Killer »

Mikejc wrote:Sorry to ask a Q on the back of your thread Neil but it's all to relevant to miss the chance......... Given my own cars spec (please see profile) am I asking for trouble given the fact that i'm running 1.3 bar with standard internals, ie is it a matter of time before BANG SHE GOES !?

Mikejc


You just dont know. Maybe there wasn't a casting flaw in your block. You could have a thick walled block and be fine.

My car before it cracked the block was a similar spec to yours and dynoed 325BHP, so it may go, it may not. All i recommend to any owner who is rebuilding an engine, is to start of with a fresh thick walled block, which has been ultrasonically tested and try and use stock size pistons wherever possible (especially Gen III owners) :evil:
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paul port
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by paul port »

MR2Mania wrote:
For Reference...
A Brand New Toyota Short-block costs 732.39 + vat
And that's with Crank, Rods and Pistons...


Paul, you wouldn't happen to know the part nos for those prices, would you?


Short-Block: 90119-08B60

paul
jonno
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by jonno »

Just for fun I called Fensport and asked about blocks, prices for the short block including crank, rods and pistons is 1500, just the block and pistons is 1100!

What planet are they on? Their prices seem to get higher and higher at the same rate as Adrians Corolla dyno chart :)
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stevecordiner
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by stevecordiner »

jonno wrote:
What planet are they on? Their prices seem to get higher and higher at the same rate as Adrians Corolla dyno chart :)


Lol ... :D

Try comparing their prices for turbo chargers on their own to atpturbo.com! :shock:

I'd happily stock turbos on the shelf for an 80% markup :D
Small turbos - they're not big and they're not clever!

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MR2Mania
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by MR2Mania »

paul port wrote:
MR2Mania wrote:
For Reference...
A Brand New Toyota Short-block costs 732.39 + vat
And that's with Crank, Rods and Pistons...


Paul, you wouldn't happen to know the part nos for those prices, would you?


Short-Block: 90119-08B60

paul


LOL! Paul, I've just been checking the EPC to find part nos, and then got prices from Mr T, and the number you posted costs 42p each. That would be GREAT if that was the block, huh? ;)

The part nos I came up with are:

1) 11401-79676
seems to be the block alone (there is another one, ending -79675, which the EPC says "9311-9801", which I'd say is the original block, and that this new number is the superceded "thick-walled" one). Incidentally, the EPC says that the part no was used from "0201", ie beginning of 2002, so I'd say this was the thick-walled block.

2) 12121-88463 (1 off) [plate, oil pan baffle]
This seems to be the sump baffle plate

3) 90119-08B60 (4 off)
I reckon these are 4 bolts that hold the sump baffle to the underneath of the block. You see, there are 6 holes, but on mine, we had to use thicker bolts as the sump threads were larger, so this is what I think this is about.

With regards to whether baffle is needed, I did a search for that part on it's own, and it seems to be the same part no for the Rev3 anyway, so unless it needs replacing everytime when rebuilding, I don't think that particular part is needed.

Jonno, you've got all this in an email, matey! ;)
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jonno
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by jonno »

Thanks Dino,

I have just called Bri and asked him to get a price on the block with his discount. Im just not sure what happens if the new block turns out to be thin walled? Will Toyota just take it back and replace it with a thick walled block?
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Icsunonove
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Re: TOTB4 - Who wants to be involved?

Post by Icsunonove »

Neil, haven't read the previous few posts, do you still need 86mm pistons? If you do, looks like it's your lucky day

http://www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic. ... highlight=
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