bad vibes after koni kit and poly bushes

[tomsky]

Last year I bit the bullet and replaced all the suspension with a koni adjustable damper/spring kit, replaced the all bushes with a full super pro kit, changed drop links and ball joints alround. Ideally I would have liked to have kept the standard suspension but as nothing seems to be available I thought this would make an acceptable improvement based on the good comments on this forum. After living with it for a while I have to say its some what spoilt how i feel about the car. With the quality of the roads now it seems to crash, bounce and jiggle you over everything with a real lack of compliance and is pretty uncomfortable on anything other than a complete smooth surface (rare). The settings seem to do little for ride comfort and just seem to either increase how much float you get when you hit a crest in the road or make things even crashier. Id be interested in thoughts but im now trying to look into whats at fault and here whether its the springs (lesjofors supplied with kit) or the bushes that are creating the hardness and crashing quality over poor surfaces.

[SuperRedMR2]

Hi,

I've got exactly the same setup as you have and mine have been on for 6 years now. I have standard old bushes which have never been replaced but my handling was excellent (when the car worked).

I've changed my settings about depending on weather conditions and it always made a difference which setting they were on. Mind you, I have them all the same on each strut, not different settings on different corners.

Have you had your alignment done?

[tomsky]

hi thanks for the comparison, yeh did have alignment done after, starting to think its the harshness of the bushes i dont like, heard some people suggesting only polybushing certain areas such as roll bars etc

[Samc]

Yeah that's quite a big change all in one hit! How do you find it now, got used to it all? Polybushing mine soon as a daily its made me think twice, but I guess stock toyota bushes are hard to come by/mega expensive?!

Anyone know the shore rating of the superpro kit?

[PW@Woodsport]

Been polybushing Mk1s for nearly 20 years now and never had an issue, also the Koni kit is by far the best suspension for a stock engined Mk1.

I suspect the difference you are feeling is between 30 year old worn out stock rubbers and nice tight new bushes. The polys offer fantastic road feedback.

[tomsky]

Maybe its just me and it has tightened everthing up but on todays crumbling roads crashing and jiggling about over stuff so your driving to avoid things is not really my bag. Perhaps its a combination of the lowered springs or just the bush type but its left me wanting to put it back as it was.

[jimi]

What about new standard bushes ? or even new TRD rubber bushes ?
I've always resisted poly bushes because I don't want to end up in your position and regret changing bushes. I have heard that TRD bushes are harder than standard but softer than poly and can still be bought but are expensive and I have no idea where to get them from.

[SuperRedMR2]

Hi,

I've got exactly the same setup as you have and mine have been on for 6 years now. I have standard old bushes which have never been replaced but my handling was excellent (when the car worked).

I've changed my settings about depending on weather conditions and it always made a difference which setting they were on. Mind you, I have them all the same on each strut, not different settings on different corners.

Have you had your alignment done?

I also have a mk2 turbo ARB on the rear of mine which severely stiffens up the rear adding to my good handling

[tomsky]

thanks for everyones help/suggestions. I guess having had the car for over ten years ive got used to what I like about it and felt Mr T got a good balance to start with. Think will look at keeping the poly bushes in places where it helps like roll bars etc and look to swap the others back to standard where the ride quality is affected. Maybe its also the superpro bushes compared to other types. Out of interest are standard bushes still available at the dealers or anywhere else

[un1eash]

Exact same setup I had on my mk1 for nearly 8 years. I replaced all the bushes, drop links, ball joints, konis and lesfor springs around the same time.

The car after was very tight and I found you had to run the koni's around half stiffness(1 full turn), just enough to take out any body roll and dipping under hard braking. Too hard though and the car bounced along the road and lifted on bumps.

[Fab4MR2]

For me, the longer you own one of these, and become more attuned to its nuances, the better. Unfortunately, it probably would have been better if you had made some of these suspension changes one at a time in order to see how each benefited, or hindered what you preferred in ride quality. But I know that's not always an easy accommodation, lol. That being said, the polys are definitely the likely suspect in your discomfort. While they can produce more extreme feedback they can probably also produce a rather jarring effect to one who has become used to riding on an older oem type suspension. Many probably enjoy the extra stiffness, while others will find it rather objectionable.

These cars can handle great with the oem bushings, and all the other mods. You can't just buy new oem bushes though, as they only come installed in oem suspension arms, and the rear ones may now be discontinued from what I saw recently. MKI TRD bushings have been discontinued for some time, but would have been a great upgrade without the extreme feedback of the polys. If you can't get new oem suspension arms try installing a decent set of used ones. Deterioration from age, in these bushings, is greatly exaggerated, and would be worth giving a shot. Otherwise, while hard to obtain, I believe Cusco still produces Hyper bushings for the MKI, and are a cross between rubber and poly, so to speak. For me, polys are best used for sway bar and strut bar bushing replacements, where they provide significant compression resistance, and better suspension accuracy without adding significant stiffness to the overall ride.

[PW@Woodsport]

In my opinion the springs/shocks are providing 90%-95% of the road feedback, all the harder bushes are doing is transmitting a little more NVH than the stock worn ones and preventing them from moving around.

While an immediate difference in feel can be felt after polybushing i suspect most of that is the huge difference between worn out 30 year old rubber and tight new PB's

I bet if you stick a set of stock shocks on the car it will transform it without the need to touch the bushes, in short i believe the bushes are not to blame as i've owned many bushed Mk1s that all felt great.

[jayelem]

Hi. I had a stock mk1 until recently which I loved but I had it polybushed & it took the joy out of it altogether for me & although some of it may be due to the roads I would not do it again as it reminded me of my type r fn2 which almost cracked my fillings. I have just bought a cracking mk1 s/c & it takes me back to loving driving again as its not p/bushed.

[tomsky]

thats useful comparison jayelem glad somebodys with me on the standard was actually a good balance for todays roads. Its just a shame theres so few sources for standard suspension components these days.

[jayelem]

I forgot to add I previously had new stock shocks & apex springs fitted which improved it no end then had the polybushes done & spoilt it.

[Fab4MR2]

Would be really nice if it were possible to make rubber replacement bushings, of varying durometers, in the same manner and style that poly bushings are made. I think they'd sell far easier, and to far more people than the poly variety.

[jimi]

+1 I'd buy a set ! It's a pity the TRD ones are unavailable, I've heard they are excellent.

[Fab4MR2]

+1 I'd buy a set ! It's a pity the TRD ones are unavailable, I've heard they are excellent.

Yes, it is a shame. I installed some on my original '85 at just over 100k miles, which I had bought new, and those, along with a set of Tokico Illuminas/original Eibach springs gave the exact suspension I was looking for, firmer, but not jarring at all. A few years back I installed a new set that I had saved on an '89 SC, but didn't notice much of a change, which was very disappointing (they were also used with Illuminas/TRD Gymkhana springs). Since my SC got rear ended I will be switching the TRD bushed control arms and strut rods over to a MKIa replacement, and hope for better things.

Not sure what struts I will use as I have tried several over the years and haven't been particularly happy with any in quite awhile. It is my opinion that Tokico changed their valving shortly after I purchased my first set of them years back. That set could give a very firm, but non-jarring ride, while the 2-3 sets I've tried since all seemed to be somewhat heat sensitive, and would get a bit jarring on stiffer settings after a half hour use or more. Also tried Koni's and seemed to experience some of the same after continued use. Other recent non-adjustable struts just seemed too soft. Would buy a set of Bilsteins if they still made them, as those were quite nice for a non-adjustable, but never handled the same after having them eventually rebuilt. Best I've tried in years were the jdm KYB SSS's adjustables, but incredibly expensive, and only made for the MKIb's.