[Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Posts about anything do to with modifying your car such as fitting aftermarket parts, bodykit, or tuning the engine for more performance.

Moderators: IMOC Moderators, IMOC Committee Members

BALDYMONSTER
Posts: 581
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 7:39 am

[Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by BALDYMONSTER »

As per title.

I basically really want to reduce front end lift at high speed and I am leaning towards the Aeroware front spoiler, side skirts the ones with the direct replacement side scoop lips, rear spats and the larger TRD rea spoiler.

PS: Do the Rev 5 front anti speed lift flaps of which there are two of one on each side in front of the front wheels really make that much of a diffence.

The car is lowered with 25% uprated shock inserts and -40mm progressive lowering springs all round.

I look forward to more experienced members giving their input.

Chris.
pbmr2
Posts: 929
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2010 12:49 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by pbmr2 »

hahaha leave your dreams somewhere else. there is no DF here.
rear spats? hahaha that's a proper cracker right there.

nothing off the shelf will help your goal.

your best bet is to sort the suspension and weight distribution so that it's more balanced the way you want. so far is sounds too stiff and too low, this ain't helping.

What alignment are you running? what's the wheel and tyre setup?

a proper front lip will help, that's not just a bit of trim stuck on through. as will extended (not stock rev5) speed flaps on all 4 wheels. vent the arches at the rear edges.
beyond that there is a huge amount of detail you can go into but I'd be surprised that on the road if any of it would be of use for what you think your feeling.

the mechanical setup is much more likely to help. though a proper (and i don't mean a stick on lip) front splitter/air dam will show results at higher speeds.

What effects are you trying to overcome or change? front lift? well it's a rear weighted car and while on throttle the weight shift is placing more pressure on the rear axle. learn to use the chassis to your advantage.
brake in a straight line, turn-in off brake and off throttle and then get on the power early. that is the strength of mid engine. you have to learn how to load up the corners.
it stops harder and starts going earlier than a front engine setup. one of the compromises of mid engine is that it isn't best at everything but overall it's a faster setup than other layouts. on power the front lifts, suspension can compensate most of that.

My old mk2 rev1 on stock suspension could leave an evo 6 for dead on a B road as an mr2 can do things most cars can't. the car was on stilts and not even staggered tyres. learn to use your weapon.
User avatar
Ryan S
IMOC Moderator
Posts: 10902
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2005 1:32 pm
Location: Bonnie Dundee
Contact:

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by Ryan S »

I hear about this issue, I've had 4 mr2s I've never experienced it. I'm on stock shocks with 30mm lowering springs. Had this mr2 up to 140+mph and still never experienced it. Having said that it is the least planted car I've ever owned. Agree with above though, I doubt a bodykit will help much, Most likely a case of get used to how it handles or go for an extreme change of suspension components. Also, are you actually experiencing lift? Or just very light steering? The mr2s power steering is speed dependant, faster you go the heavier the steering should be. I've heard of issues when changing imports dials to UK dials.
rev2rich
Posts: 519
Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 4:43 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by rev2rich »

1. Make sure all the under trays are fitted this will help

2. Vented wings as mentioned.. But only useful if you are going to run brake ducting in to the wheel arch.. But again check you have the wheel sh!t shield in

3 Border front bonnet + the rad relocation kit does help but costly..

4 Rev 5 speed flap do work as it was Toyotas answer to the problem..

5 Border front conards ( designed for the stock bumper) but again costly but never seen in person to know if it worth the money..

6 the front of the car was designed with the spare wheel jack and tools so weighting the front may make it feel less light... Should also have the plastic trim over the rad area also..m

Can't think of any more but it is personal feeling what light feels like...

Hope that helps Rich :thumleft:
Race Idiot
Posts: 2589
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:48 pm
Location: Hertfordshire

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by Race Idiot »

Part or all of your suspension/steering/alignment/tyres are probably xxxxx. Bolting on aftermarket bodykits will make xxxx all difference.

Undertrays do help but most of mine were missing and my car feels pretty stable at 100+ mph speeds. It's never going to feel as stable at high speed as something with the engine in the front.

Another thing to think about is the power steering system, is it working correctly as over a certain speed it should turn off. If it's still on at motorway speeds the assistance makes the steering feel horrible
User avatar
Jaspa
IMOC Moderator
Posts: 4833
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2005 10:54 pm
Location: Gatwick (ish)

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by Jaspa »

Image

:thumleft:
I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness.
Race Idiot
Posts: 2589
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:48 pm
Location: Hertfordshire

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by Race Idiot »

I forgot about the PP 'Front Spoiler' haha.
BALDYMONSTER
Posts: 581
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 7:39 am

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by BALDYMONSTER »

I didn't actually think rear spats would increase downforce, I was just reffering to the overall style of kit.

All undertrays are in place, car lowered -40mm and alignment all done although I haven't played about with having it tweaked much. Tyre's are Kumho Ecsta Le Sports KU39's. Power steering is disconnecting properly at speed also.

The vented front wings are most definitely on the cards as is an aeroware front lip/spoiler, sideskirts and rear spats are undecided. But rev 5 speed flaps are a definite also.

Thanks for the input regarding driving style, I fully admit I have always kept some power going to the rear wheels when cornering but what's been said makes sense. Thank you.

But as for an EVO 6 leaving that MR2 for dead, now that was genuinely funny. I've had an EVO and even with a filter, good tyres, decent exhaust like a Nurspec there is not a hope in hell anything other than a very very powerful MR2 would get near it. And when I say get near it I mean maybe make up the ground on a few decent straights, perhaps. Trying to put the power down like an EVO can non stop everywhere in an MR2? Yeah right.

And that was with around 300bhp, before I really tuned it.
pbmr2
Posts: 929
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2010 12:49 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by pbmr2 »

you're building a 400+ hp car and don't know how to use a mid engine setup to full effect? spend some money on driver training.. or life insurance. I was hoping my commnets were akin to teaching egg sucking.

aerowave lip will not do anything useful, might look great though. side skirts will prob block air coming out of the front arches, they normally do.

imo -40mm is too low for the suspension design.

rear spats block airflow so help to maintain high pressure in the arches which helps with both drag and lift. you don't want either.

yes any evo would leave the rev1 NA for dead on a straight road, you go down a local twisty B road and good full beans in the MR2 and the apex speed just can't be matched by other cars, power doesn't matter at this point. you're welcome to try and follow me :D sadly no longer have the rev1 but will put a good fight in the rev4.

maybe the other driver didn't know the road well or have skill or tyres to keep with a 156bhp mr2 doing triple figures at the apexes? even an mr2 turbo with more power would prob struggle as they weigh more so the apex speed may drop.
The driver is the weakest links in all of our cars and I know that car and road well. sure at the end of the 7 consecutive corners the road is more open, the evo caught back up before the next village. He was some distance back though coming out of the last apex.
the mk2 rev1 didn't even have the rev2+ front lip on it, the front end was well planted enough at up to about 200kph. the suspension was setup well though and it had decent tyres.

Do you still run a spare wheel in the front of the car? it's about 1% of the car's weight so if removed the balance goes to the rear by 1% more.
The rev1/2 rear spoilers are heavy too, removing them for a later one and removing the boot floor stuff helps to tip the scales toward the front. but suspension changes make much more difference to the feel.

my car has had many tiny mods to help the weight balance, I'm yet to drive it again so we'll see if it's had the desired effect. there are over 130 mods, most focused on chassis balance. there are no aero mods... yet.

In my daily rev4 with stock everything I can feel the weight shift as the fuel burns off, it goes towards the rear as the fuel level goes down. drive round with a tenner in the tank and the front feels much lighter, though it still corners about the same. I just use a little more off throttle as the chassis feels like it needs it. but most of the time you can really take the p1$$
BALDYMONSTER
Posts: 581
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 7:39 am

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by BALDYMONSTER »

Thanks PBMR. That's some very good advice and comes across as well finded so makes sense.

The frunk has the spare wheel and toolkit and for a while it had my toolbox in the front which seems to help any high speed front end lift.

The car is only running 16 psi on a full Rev3 conversion but I will be looking to go down the forged route with head benchflowed, cams and a bigger turbo.

The Rev 5 speed flaps I think will be the next purchase and the Aeroware front lip/spoiler with side skirts, rear spats and larger TRD Spoiler plus vented front wings I'm pretty set on despite the honest feedback about this not necessarily making any great differences to downforce I love the look.

All positive feedback appreciated and noted . Thank you.
Last edited by BALDYMONSTER on Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
pbmr2
Posts: 929
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2010 12:49 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by pbmr2 »

rev5 speed flaps do help, however you could make some better ones for about half the price.

take a walk around you local supermarket carpark this weekend, pay special attention to SUV/Chelsea Tractor front (and rear) wheel speed flaps. they are huge these days!
Bigger is better for this device. In motorsport they put a little front splitter on the bottom of them too. food for thought.

If the tool box in the front helps, maybe the front springs are too stiff? What spring rate are they? What dampers do you have?
2barGee
Posts: 2409
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2004 6:13 pm
Location: Pontefract

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by 2barGee »

BALDYMONSTER wrote:Thanks PBMR. That's some very good advice and comes across as well finded so makes sense.

The drink has the spare wheel and toolkit and for a while it had my toolbox in the front which seems to help any high speed front end lift.

The car is only running 16 psi on a full Rev3 conversion but I will be looking to go down the forged route with head benchflowed, cams and a bigger turbo.

The Rev 5 speed flaps I think will be the next purchase and the Awrware front lip/spoiler with side skirts, rear spats and larger TRD Spoiler plus vented front wings I'm pretty set on despite the honest feedback about this not necessarily making any great differences to downforce I love the look.

All positive feedback appreciated and noted . Thank you.


No point doing cams unless it's a drag car for me as it will move the power right up the top end. Will make it gash on the road also. I'd leave the head alone as well. Save some brass.
Race Idiot
Posts: 2589
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:48 pm
Location: Hertfordshire

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by Race Idiot »

pbmr2 wrote:
maybe the other driver didn't know the road well or have skill or tyres to keep with a 156bhp mr2 doing triple figures at the apexes? even an mr2 turbo with more power would prob struggle as they weigh more so the apex speed may drop.


Please don't drive 100mph round corners on a B road, thanks.
pbmr2
Posts: 929
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2010 12:49 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by pbmr2 »

Race Idiot wrote:
pbmr2 wrote:
maybe the other driver didn't know the road well or have skill or tyres to keep with a 156bhp mr2 doing triple figures at the apexes? even an mr2 turbo with more power would prob struggle as they weigh more so the apex speed may drop.


Please don't drive 100mph round corners on a B road, thanks.


:roll:
Race Idiot
Posts: 2589
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:48 pm
Location: Hertfordshire

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by Race Idiot »

Fine I don't give a xxxx, but don't go round bragging like billy big balls about it I guess.
pbmr2
Posts: 929
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2010 12:49 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by pbmr2 »

Race Idiot wrote:Fine I don't give a xxxx, but don't go round bragging like billy big balls about it I guess.


:roll:
alanmr2turbo
Posts: 2238
Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Birmingham
Contact:

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by alanmr2turbo »

me think pbmr2 isn't long for this world.

He knows the car and the road well so i can do triple figures at the apex.

Ummmmm now formula one drivers know their cars and know the tracks so how come off the track or plant themselves into the barriers? :-k :-k :-k :-k

I'm guessing they do it on purpose to make good viewing and cost the sponsors hundreds of thousands each crash. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
gavsdavs
Posts: 702
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:31 pm
Location: saahfeeeeastlaandun

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by gavsdavs »

Feeling light at the front is generally due to stuff like worn bearings or play in the steering rack, poor geometry, bad tyre pressures. You know, stuff you should fix.

Bunging on a different body kit without addressing the underlying problem you have isn't going to help.

Undertrays reduce buffeting and stabilise the car (and are quieter and more economic).

Rev 5 wheel arch flaps stop/break up wind going into the front arches and also reduce noise, and I suspect help with economy too.

Lowering a car 40mm generally doesn't help make a car pliant and predictable on all surfaces.
mrhappy62
Posts: 139
Joined: Wed May 20, 2015 7:21 pm
Location: rustington

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by mrhappy62 »

gavsdavs wrote:Feeling light at the front is generally due to stuff like worn bearings or play in the steering rack, poor geometry, bad tyre pressures. You know, stuff you should fix.

Bunging on a different body kit without addressing the underlying problem you have isn't going to help.


Felt light at front end on a kent run a while ago now but at stupid speed in a straight line! not sure who was behind me jim or gareth but we both backed off and mentioned it at Breakfast !
gavsdavs
Posts: 702
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:31 pm
Location: saahfeeeeastlaandun

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] Best bodykit for increasing downforce?

Post by gavsdavs »

mrhappy62 wrote:
gavsdavs wrote:Feeling light at the front is generally due to stuff like worn bearings or play in the steering rack, poor geometry, bad tyre pressures. You know, stuff you should fix.

Bunging on a different body kit without addressing the underlying problem you have isn't going to help.


Felt light at front end on a kent run a while ago now but at stupid speed in a straight line! not sure who was behind me jim or gareth but we both backed off and mentioned it at Breakfast !

On kent runs we're normally on b-roads with bumps and cambers all over the place. Sit at 100 on a motorway, how does it feel ? (Mine is generally prety good, not really any different to 50mph)
Post Reply

Return to “Modifications”