Capable track toy?

[Mbland]

Apologies as I'm sure this has been asked before but have searched with no real joy.

I'm considering coming back to the fold and getting another turbo beginning of next year but since my last ownership involved a pretty much out and out show car this time I'm more interested in experiencing track days etc after just selling my track prepped 306 (200bhp/tonne) I'm considering a 2 turbo.

So my main question is how capable are they on track etc as Allthough I never pushed my last one to much due to its looks I still remember everytime it rained there seemed to be another "crash" thread posted.

So any experience would be greatly recieved

[Adam86]

Cars are track ready. Just get some Carbotech pads and good fluid and your sorted. Handle great, reliable & very quick. Very rewarding car to drive at speed but you need to be smooth to get the most out of them. Non of this power on power off rubbish.

[Tedtiler]

The turbo in stock form will probably either overheat or do a head gasket unless everything is 100 per cent perfect condition under the bonnet. Make sure it's ready for abuse before you go there. Extra inter cooling would be good.

[Tedtiler]

And if it's a wet track day you'd probably go as fast in a stripped out rev 3 na

[Adam86]

And if it's a wet track day you'd probably go as fast in a stripped out rev 3 na

You won't & im speaking from experience.

Bigger IC as said above forgot about that one lol. Even at standard boost.

[Mbland]

Cool thanks

And is it still regarded as around 1-1.2bar boost on ct20? And is that reliable on track. My old one was a rev2 and I had a gt4 charge cooler system so was considering the same again all be it this time I'd like to start with a rev 3

[Adam86]

Yeh 1.1-1.2 you'll be ok. My rev3 is running the GT4 cc at similar boost levels on CT20. Done many track miles.

[Mbland]

Cool sounds good to me then, descision made need to get back in a 2

[hellreign]

I'd say you'd want to stay at aroun 1.1bar. It hink from memorty that 1.2 is close to Stock Fuel cut, which is not a pleasant experience.

However and FCD (not the best) of mapped aftermarket ECU (big bucks) will negate this

Usual obvious stuff will be better cooling required to protect the engine, and the dreaded DET

[Lauren]

The MK3 is the better car for track work. Much better chassis.

It doesn't have the straight line pace of a MK2 turbo, but it's lighter and the chassis is more intuitive with a good handling balance.

[Mbland]

A mk3 is not a option as but to small for me. I'm really pushed towards a mr2 its just all this talk of losing them on the limit that is the only thing putting me off

[Lauren]

To be frank a better option in that case is the MK2 NA. It's a better handling car than the turbo. A turbo doesn't suit the chassis.

They are tricky cars to handle on the limit and the manner in which the boost arrives doesn't help that.

So, an NA is a better bet. Rev3-5 is the one to go for.

Or go for something different like a DC2 Integra Type-R. Far, far better chassis and engine. Much more suited to trackwork and is brilliant out of the box.

[Adam86]

A 170bhp MR2 is always going to be easier to handle than a 300bhp MR2. You've enough power to over power the rear tyres with ALOT less throttle. Doesn't mean it handles worse.

The turbo is the faster car and more of a challenge because of the extra power. Not because the N/A handles better! The N/A is just easier to drive. In the same way a 130bhp MR2 would be easier to "handle" than 170bhp MR2.

Everyone thinks if you hit boost mid corner your off. That'll only happen if plant it. That includes the wet. If you want to increase speed by 1mph you can. The throttle is not an on/off button with the standard turbo like people seem to suggest.

But yes the N/A is the easier car to drive. But its NOT faster with the same driver.

[Lauren]

True enough. The problem is the turbo is harder to balance mid corner due to the turbo lag. With all that weight behind you it takes some quick responses to hold on to it. So it's harder to modulate the throttle response and you end up pumping the throttle to keep the boost up. It's fine to be fair when you get used to it, but an NA has better throttle response. Also an open diff makes it easier to handle.

The OP was worried about the turbo being tricky handling wise. It is, I reckon.

It's a challenge and if that's what you like then that's cool.

I guess what I meant is that 170odd bhp is about right for the MK2 chassis. The more you up the ante, the harder it is to handle. Also consumables tend to go up in price, stuff like tyres and brake pads of course.

Also depends if going as absolutely fast as possible and breaking lap records is what you're out to do. Track days are about having fun and this is well worth remembering. I could put sticky tyres on my GT86 for example and be loads quicker, but I'd simply rather have more fun on the stock set up.

[Adam86]

True enough. The problem is the turbo is harder to balance mid corner due to the turbo lag. With all that weight behind you it takes some quick responses to hold on to it. So it's harder to modulate the throttle response and you end up pumping the throttle to keep the boost up.

What lag? Pump the throttle?? Come on if you do that you DESERVE to crash!!

The CT20 doesn't even have lag above 4000rpm and it has very little 500rpm below that. So you never drop off boost at track rpms. Or am l driving a different MR2 to everyone else?

I give up! I'm not even going to continue with the rest of my post

[woz_106]

I've never had an issue with the ct20 having such lag to cause any issues with mid corner handling of the mr2. I find it has a very smooth delivery if you drive the car via the throttle.

To the op, it depends what you want out of a trackday as to the car you go for next. Do you want to be quick, be entertained, be scared, or be precise.

If you want to be quick and not do much in the way of input then buy something 4wd then you can drive very on/off the power and afford to be very aggressive. Failing that your already coming from fwd so know how to drive a fwd car properly there fore you will be bored in 6 months if you buy an Integra my 106gti used to laugh at them as I learnt how to drive that car very well and that's why I bought the 2 I wanted a sense of fear and something rwd that would be a challenge.

If you want to be entertained and dick about buy something front engine rwd like an m3 or such. You can drive them on the edge and hold them very well.

If you want to be scared drive an mid engined car like you drove your 306 and you'll be terrified especially the sight of armco or tyres getting rather close lol.

If you want to be precise, buy an mr2 learn how to drive all over again, start off slow I was terrified on my first trackday in the mr2 turbo coming from a track setup 106gti. Learn how your throttle and steering input have to work together and the feel of endless grip but the instant lack of when you over step. The mr2 is a very rewarding and challenging car to drive on a track, you may not be the quickest all the time but when your on fire you'll happily chase down those 4wd saloons that everyone thinks are quick 😉

Oh and wet track days are the best to learn on, just remember your braking is drastically effected and use the time to practice how your inputs effect the cars behavior.

[Lauren]

What lag? Pump the throttle?? Come on if you do that you DESERVE to crash!!

The CT20 doesn't even have lag above 4000rpm and it has very little 500rpm below that. So you never drop off boost at track rpms. Or am l driving a different MR2 to everyone else?

I give up! I'm not even going to continue with the rest of my post

I don't want to argue with you and might be worth not banging your head up against a wall, but if that's what you want to do...

However, it does have lag and when you make throttle adjustments mid corner it is simply not as responsive as an NA. If you can't tell that, fine tune your right foot a bit more.

This, is what makes it trickier to handle when you are in a situation where you need to vary the throttle to balance the car. As I said you learn to compensate by tending to pump the throttle a bit to, but it does lack a little finesse compared to an NA car.

I've driven every variation of MR2 on track in my time and this is what I noticed with the turbo.

[Adam86]

Different driving styles. I'm as smooth as possible. Especially with the MR2.

I'm never making throttle adjustments mid corner. To me if that's the case the driver is getting back on the power too early. My turbo is always spooled up throughout the corner because im either holding my corner entry speed to keep weight transfer equal and balanced or slowly increasing throttle for a good exit. So it never drops off the boost apart from the time during braking when im off the throttle apart from blipping. But the the revs are that high your not waiting for the turbo to spool once back on the throttle. It's near instant.

I'm never going to suggest the turbo as the same throttle response as the N/A. Especially if you lift off completely such as when braking. I know it doesn't l owned an N/A it was a great car. But the 'lag' is so so minimal it shouldn't cause an issue if your smooth.

[woz_106]

What lag? Pump the throttle?? Come on if you do that you DESERVE to crash!!

The CT20 doesn't even have lag above 4000rpm and it has very little 500rpm below that. So you never drop off boost at track rpms. Or am l driving a different MR2 to everyone else?

I give up! I'm not even going to continue with the rest of my post

I don't want to argue with you and might be worth not banging your head up against a wall, but if that's what you want to do...

However, it does have lag and when you make throttle adjustments mid corner it is simply not as responsive as an NA. If you can't tell that, fine tune your right foot a bit more.

This, is what makes it trickier to handle when you are in a situation where you need to vary the throttle to balance the car. As I said you learn to compensate by tending to pump the throttle a bit to, but it does lack a little finesse compared to an NA car.

I've driven every variation of MR2 on track in my time and this is what I noticed with the turbo.

Fine tuning a driving style maybe a better alternative rather than someone else to fine tune their right foot...after all you should only be pressing the throttle fully down when you know you don't have to take it off. Not pumping away like a good'n Christ that sounds like some one who drives an evo's tactics and drives like there ass has a just sat on a branding iron.

[Lauren]

LOL!

Well, it does have lag. That's it really. It's not as responsive as an NA when you come off the throttle and go back on again is it? I'm not talking about pushing the throttle fully down, I'm talking about minute adjustments in the middle of a corner where you are adjusting the attitude of the car on the throttle. It's harder to do as accurately with a turbo.

No idea why I'm bothering. The correct answer is that it's an amazing track car. Sure it's difficult to drive but that's what makes it brilliant.

Better?