hi guys, iv been away from the mk1 for a few years and have come back to one again after not finding the excitement i had from my old mk1b. iv just bought a mica blue t bar 88' , the car is going to be used on a fair few trackdays next year and has tired suspension which needs rejuvinating for next year, iv bought a ncie set of 15" wheels which has helped the grip a lot and am going to be spending around 1k - 1.5k getting the car ready for the track. iv budgeted for a full poly bush set and suspension, anything left over will be put towards brakes and engine mods. iv spotted like some of you have the D2 suspension sets from new zealand on ebay, after speaking to the guy, it seems a really good deal for what is in there. has anyone bought a set, what spring rates did you specify, and what was your rating of them?? i will be using the car as a daily driver too but dont mind a harsh ride if it makes up for it on the b roads thanks for your time, and its good to be back.
p.s. im also hoping if i can get it set up cheaply enough putting a sc engine in it, if anyones for one lying around (worth a try ) could you pm me!
hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
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Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
according to an inside source the D2 coilovers are inferior quality and suffer from premature top mount wear with zero customer support
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
thanks paul for the quick reply, what would you reccommend for around the 400-500 mark shocks+springs?
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
Most popular option would probably be the Koni SSK should be able to get that for £350-400
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Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
ive just recieved my d2 kit looks good quality but only for track use so wear rate is not important handling and adjustment more so. it does say not for road use though and cant imagine it would last long on the road with no rubber to take the shock out of pot holes etc.
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
aye, keep me posted on it how it performs when its on, i am more interested in the raw performance on track for the setup
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
even if the quality of materials and manufacture were good (which they arent, plus the fitment is usually pretty poor in my experience), the damping characteristics are pretty shocking. zero bump force, LOADS of rebound. totally the opposite of what you want
for that kind of money id go with Koni Yellow inserts in the standard strut cases, adjustable top mounts if you feel you need the camber adjustment (youll set it once probably, and then leave it, youd be better spending the money on a proper alignment), and a ground control (or similar) coilover kit for an MX5/Miata which will fit onto the MR2 struts if you want adjustable ride height/spring preload
for that kind of money id go with Koni Yellow inserts in the standard strut cases, adjustable top mounts if you feel you need the camber adjustment (youll set it once probably, and then leave it, youd be better spending the money on a proper alignment), and a ground control (or similar) coilover kit for an MX5/Miata which will fit onto the MR2 struts if you want adjustable ride height/spring preload
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Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
i totally agree with jim,koni inserts in the standard strut casings with mx5 GC kit will make a much better set up,and the springs available are a dime a dozen....as jim says,you will set the top mount once and leave it.
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
is there any reason not to use the mr2 specific ground control coil over kit?
they list different part numbers - or are they same parts with different application part number? (bit like Girling - same part with different part numbers for different application - and different prices!)
Si
they list different part numbers - or are they same parts with different application part number? (bit like Girling - same part with different part numbers for different application - and different prices!)
Si
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
MR2 ground control kits are harder to come by, there are loads of cheap alternative ones for MX5's, and its pretty much a straight fit. there just seems to be more of a market for the MX5 ones. if you can get a mk1 MR2 just as easily then do
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Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
TBH the KYB's are pretty spot-on for track use, great value for money too
I love them on our mk1a, but am also thinking they would be good on our SC too.
no sure how much 'extra' handling benefit you get for your bucks for going coilover....
I love them on our mk1a, but am also thinking they would be good on our SC too.
no sure how much 'extra' handling benefit you get for your bucks for going coilover....
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
I agree with Jo here - if the car is predominantly going to be used for track why not get a set of unajustable KYB's with some decent progressive springs - as she said, the setup has worked very well for our 1a.
If it's specifically coilovers you're after, I'm sure you'll hear some pretty good feedback from those running Leda's - not sure what £££ they are though...
Does Tein not produce a coilover set for the AW11 too?
Apart from upgrading the suspension, you should also be looking at adjustable droplinks and chunky Whiteline ARB's
If it's specifically coilovers you're after, I'm sure you'll hear some pretty good feedback from those running Leda's - not sure what £££ they are though...
Does Tein not produce a coilover set for the AW11 too?
Apart from upgrading the suspension, you should also be looking at adjustable droplinks and chunky Whiteline ARB's
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Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
mr2mk1chick wrote:
no sure how much 'extra' handling benefit you get for your bucks for going coilover....
Well with 'coilovers' you can corner weight properly and obviously have the ride height to suit. But, it depends if you want to go to those lengths.
Agree KYBs are a good budget choice, though if he can stretch a little i think its worth going for the koni's with decent springs if poss.
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Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
i can get the koni sport package with blue springs for 499 as well, im just worried that il regret not going for coilovers because of the better adjustability, does anyone use these D2 coilovers or have been in a car with them properly set up? i have budgeted for drop links and maybe an uprated arb on the rear, does the mk1b have a ar on the back or is it just the mk1a? cheers for the advice guys!
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Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
the only extra adjustment you get on the d2's is the ride height. camber can be adjusted already on stock suspension, rebound damping can be adjusted on koni's and the ride would be much better. the d2's would be dangerous on the road you would be skipping across the road with the slightest bump. plus they just wouldnt last with the british rods you can get a koni kit for less than £400 if you shop around.
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
cheers, il look into getting a super street kit then from koni i guess, there are some bad potholes around here in the northwest roads
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
ive worked with a few sets of D2's on various cars, i fitted some last week in fact and set the car up, so ive got some thoughts on them
heres the problems i have with them, considering i build dampers day in day out for my job. my opinions on road car dampers are a little skewed as im used to working on Ohlins, which are one of (if not THE) best damper manufacturers in the world, and so most other stuff looks worse to me. but still, ive got real-world perspective and can judge the lower end stuff on its merits...
1. they look pretty, but the anodizing is really poor. it chips off at the slightest contact. especially on the adjustable top mounts, as soon as you adjust the camber it scrapes the anodizing off
2. they are clearly made in China or a Chinese territory, and are made to the cheapest price possible, at the expense of quality. whilst this isnt a specific problem with the damper, it never stands a product in good stead
3. the damper design itself is a generic monotube setup, which can work very well. but the internal design just isnt very good, theres more to mono dampers than just shims on a piston, and its the specific details that set apart the likes of Ohlins and Sachs from crap like Gaz, Leda, D2, etc
4. the people who design the damper, clearly dont look at the car they are intended for....
a) lengths are often too short. this might be done on purpose to lower the car, but its always by too much. so in order to keep the car from being sat on the floor you have to wind the ride height adjustment all the way down. which then means it cant be used for height adjustment any more, except to go lower (and youre already too low)
b) they have adjustable drop link brackets on some of them. but they can never wind into the right place to fit the standard drop links. so you need adjustable ones (which all cars should have anyway if theyre being fitted with proper suspension, so that roll bar preload can be removed)
c) they dont have brake line brackets, etc on them, but they do come with universal ones. except the universal ones never fit as is. ive had to cut, bend and drill them every time to get them to fit how they need to. Tein make shítty dampers, but they do at least have the correct brackets on them!
d) the top mounts often dont sit in the correct orientation for pure camber adjustment. if they dont sit perfectly perpendicular to the car then adjustments will significantly affect castor and toe as well.
5. their user manual recommends tightening spring platform lock rings with a screwdriver and a hammer. anyone who says a screwdrivers use is to be hit with a hammer is a moron. its something you do if youre lazy, uneducated, or have no other choice. but in an official user manual, they should at least recommend using a drift (aka punch). aside from the fact that using c-spanners and pulling them against each other is how race dampers have been working for years, and if done tightly they simply dont come undone! unless D2's spring platforms are poorly toleranced and/or made from crap materials
6. they are sprung WAY too stiff
7. the dampers have WAY too much rebound, and no bump damping. which makes the car feel like a go kart and the driver (assuming they are an average punter whos never driven a properly setup car, or a race car) feel like a hero. but its not genuinely fast, and theres a lot more fun to be had from a properly setup car
8. this kinda relates to point 4, but the dampers often lack droop. this isnt just to the detriment of performance, but on a road car is quite dangerous. not having droop on a bumpy road will result in wheels losing contact with the road completely. which on the driven wheels can lead to the car pulling around side to side. ive seen D2's which when fitted with the supplied springs have less than 5mm of droop travel on the front wheels of a FWD car. which is insane on a road car
just a few things i have observed. the indepedant ride height and spring preload adjustment is a cool idea and reasonably well executed, just with poor quality materials, and on dampers that cant necessarily use it. it also means that drop link, brake line, etc brackets cant be properly mounted to the strut cases.
as dampers though, they are horrific. they would work well on a drift car, il say that for them. but for road use or track use they just arent worth the money. a set of Koni's in standard strut cases, with ground control (or similar) coilover sleeves, running 2.25" or 2.5" universal springs would be FAR better. youve got camber adjustment as standard (and can buy aftermarket camber bolts to give more adjustment if required), and ride height adjustment can still be done just by winding the platforms up or down on the ground control kit. D2's are worthless IMO
heres the problems i have with them, considering i build dampers day in day out for my job. my opinions on road car dampers are a little skewed as im used to working on Ohlins, which are one of (if not THE) best damper manufacturers in the world, and so most other stuff looks worse to me. but still, ive got real-world perspective and can judge the lower end stuff on its merits...
1. they look pretty, but the anodizing is really poor. it chips off at the slightest contact. especially on the adjustable top mounts, as soon as you adjust the camber it scrapes the anodizing off
2. they are clearly made in China or a Chinese territory, and are made to the cheapest price possible, at the expense of quality. whilst this isnt a specific problem with the damper, it never stands a product in good stead
3. the damper design itself is a generic monotube setup, which can work very well. but the internal design just isnt very good, theres more to mono dampers than just shims on a piston, and its the specific details that set apart the likes of Ohlins and Sachs from crap like Gaz, Leda, D2, etc
4. the people who design the damper, clearly dont look at the car they are intended for....
a) lengths are often too short. this might be done on purpose to lower the car, but its always by too much. so in order to keep the car from being sat on the floor you have to wind the ride height adjustment all the way down. which then means it cant be used for height adjustment any more, except to go lower (and youre already too low)
b) they have adjustable drop link brackets on some of them. but they can never wind into the right place to fit the standard drop links. so you need adjustable ones (which all cars should have anyway if theyre being fitted with proper suspension, so that roll bar preload can be removed)
c) they dont have brake line brackets, etc on them, but they do come with universal ones. except the universal ones never fit as is. ive had to cut, bend and drill them every time to get them to fit how they need to. Tein make shítty dampers, but they do at least have the correct brackets on them!
d) the top mounts often dont sit in the correct orientation for pure camber adjustment. if they dont sit perfectly perpendicular to the car then adjustments will significantly affect castor and toe as well.
5. their user manual recommends tightening spring platform lock rings with a screwdriver and a hammer. anyone who says a screwdrivers use is to be hit with a hammer is a moron. its something you do if youre lazy, uneducated, or have no other choice. but in an official user manual, they should at least recommend using a drift (aka punch). aside from the fact that using c-spanners and pulling them against each other is how race dampers have been working for years, and if done tightly they simply dont come undone! unless D2's spring platforms are poorly toleranced and/or made from crap materials
6. they are sprung WAY too stiff
7. the dampers have WAY too much rebound, and no bump damping. which makes the car feel like a go kart and the driver (assuming they are an average punter whos never driven a properly setup car, or a race car) feel like a hero. but its not genuinely fast, and theres a lot more fun to be had from a properly setup car
8. this kinda relates to point 4, but the dampers often lack droop. this isnt just to the detriment of performance, but on a road car is quite dangerous. not having droop on a bumpy road will result in wheels losing contact with the road completely. which on the driven wheels can lead to the car pulling around side to side. ive seen D2's which when fitted with the supplied springs have less than 5mm of droop travel on the front wheels of a FWD car. which is insane on a road car
just a few things i have observed. the indepedant ride height and spring preload adjustment is a cool idea and reasonably well executed, just with poor quality materials, and on dampers that cant necessarily use it. it also means that drop link, brake line, etc brackets cant be properly mounted to the strut cases.
as dampers though, they are horrific. they would work well on a drift car, il say that for them. but for road use or track use they just arent worth the money. a set of Koni's in standard strut cases, with ground control (or similar) coilover sleeves, running 2.25" or 2.5" universal springs would be FAR better. youve got camber adjustment as standard (and can buy aftermarket camber bolts to give more adjustment if required), and ride height adjustment can still be done just by winding the platforms up or down on the ground control kit. D2's are worthless IMO
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
thanks jim for having the time to write that exhaustive review
oh to be able to have the 1000's to spend on nice suspension, il have a look at the koni's then, im a little confised to how i put the struts into the origional casings, are they not just a simple bolt in kit? does putting the struts in the casings mean re-valving the origional dampers or just installnig them into an out casing on the car? thanks guys, thats all the inormation i needed, im sure now i cxan make an "informed" decision now based on this lot!
oh to be able to have the 1000's to spend on nice suspension, il have a look at the koni's then, im a little confised to how i put the struts into the origional casings, are they not just a simple bolt in kit? does putting the struts in the casings mean re-valving the origional dampers or just installnig them into an out casing on the car? thanks guys, thats all the inormation i needed, im sure now i cxan make an "informed" decision now based on this lot!
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
Like you stated the konis go inside the casing of the original dampers. Its a real easy job if the drop links dont play up and you have the right tools to get the top nut of, my prefered method is pipe wrench
Re: hi guys back again and has anyone experience in the D2 suspension set
the Koni's are just a sealed insert. you crack the nut on the standard strut case, remove the old inserts, drop the Koni's in, top the case up with antifreeze around the outside, and then do the nut back up.
the coilover sleeves (should you want them) come with pretty basic instructions on how to fit them, they usually work with a sleeve and grub screws and sit on the standard spring platforms, which you can grind back to clear space
ive found a trick to removing MR2 drop links that has had a 100% success rate thus far. i put a spanner onto the nut first, then put an allen key in the end. but position the allen key so that it is locked against something solid (the strut, or whatever is closeby for it to rest against). i then use a hammer and impact the spanner to undo the nut. the impact tends to be harsh enough to break the nut loose without putting undue strain on the allen key, which almost always results in rounding off the hex socket on the end of the balljoint pin. its worked perfectly thus far, the more force you can use with the hammer, the better. upto a point, you cant afford for the allen key to slip out!
the coilover sleeves (should you want them) come with pretty basic instructions on how to fit them, they usually work with a sleeve and grub screws and sit on the standard spring platforms, which you can grind back to clear space
ive found a trick to removing MR2 drop links that has had a 100% success rate thus far. i put a spanner onto the nut first, then put an allen key in the end. but position the allen key so that it is locked against something solid (the strut, or whatever is closeby for it to rest against). i then use a hammer and impact the spanner to undo the nut. the impact tends to be harsh enough to break the nut loose without putting undue strain on the allen key, which almost always results in rounding off the hex socket on the end of the balljoint pin. its worked perfectly thus far, the more force you can use with the hammer, the better. upto a point, you cant afford for the allen key to slip out!