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RyanRs
Joined: 25 Sep 2005
Posts: 3642
Location: Medway,Kent
Feedback Score:  18
1994 Toyota MR2 Mk2 Turbo Rev3
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 Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 12:25 am Post subject: |
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a local tuner has had experience fitting and setting up a motec system and he tells me that, altho there a very cleaver piece of kit, they also can be a rite pain in the ass, and have hidden costs??
i do belive that he said, you buy the motec kit, and being as it uses its own sensors etc, you have to pay extra for some of them on top, ie knock sensor. he also said that some sensors are a bit too sensitive, ie if your working in the engine bay and drop a spanner or a bolt and it knocks a sensor, it would mean you'd have to reset that sensor and re-calibrate it??!
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MR2lover
Premium Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 2469
Location: Oxford
Feedback Score: 6
1992 Toyota MR2 Mk2 Turbo Rev2
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:45 am Post subject: |
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good writeup mike but the only reason you had a better map on the motec is because it was mapped well compared to your powerfc ![[Wink]](images/smiles/icon_wink.gif "Wink")
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skipp123
Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 2575
Feedback Score: 7
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 8:28 am Post subject: |
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| any one got nunguns web page
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Troubled
Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 211
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Troubled
Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 211
Feedback Score: 0
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:15 am Post subject: |
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| Mikejc wrote: | Hi guys ![[Smile]](images/smiles/icon_smile.gif "Smile")
Another thing I feel justifies the Motec is the fact that Dave mapped my car from scratch inside an hour ![[Shocked]](images/smiles/icon_eek.gif "Shocked") Doesn't take long to figure out how much money will be saved in mapping! I easily spent 3 or 4 times what the PFC originally cost me in mapping alone ![[Sad]](images/smiles/icon_sad.gif "Sad")
. It only stands to reason when you think that you have a superior ECU and access to the very best mappers for the unit
Mikejc |
goes back to what i said then - only as good as the map on the ECU, and that's one Major selling point of the MOTEC.
having a car mapped 3 or 4 times over just to get a map right ? - why the hell did you keep going back ? ![[d'oh!]](images/smiles/eusa_doh.gif "d'oh!")
or did you keep changing spec ?
but as you point out Mr Rowe's personal choice of who he privately maps in his own spare time can't really be taken into account by many on here - they'd have to pay full MOTEC-uk prices, add that to the initial cost and it's getting bl00dy expensive not even including unlocking things like Lauch or flatshift.
So i agree with you about horses for courses.
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V8Killer
Premium Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1743
Feedback Score: 15
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:31 am Post subject: |
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Are there any "official" Apexi dealers in the UK? (No wannabes)
What the support like for Apexi products in the UK for the PFC?
Are Apexi PFC's specific for cars or universal?
Whats the aftermarket customer support like for Apexi - in the UK?
As for Motec, the Doc seems to be highly rated. However, i've seen Adrian @ Fensport map a high power Cossie YB on a Motec M4 within 20 minutes at Bruntingthorpe ... yup 20 minutes!
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MR2 Turbo - 720/565 - Weekend
Evo IX FQ360 MR - 630/540 - Daily
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Red_Turbo
Premium Member
Joined: 21 Dec 2005
Posts: 139
Location: East Coast
Feedback Score: 0
1992 Toyota MR2 Mk2 Turbo Rev2
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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Has anyone fitted an emerald m3dk on an mr2 turbo. i had one of these ecu's a while back but never got round to fitting it to my last car and sold it cheap im sure that had a 32bit unit in it. all the graphs and options on the computer looked impressive for it. ive heard it compared to the motec as its meant to be similar but not sure what capabilities it has or if it can be used on an mr2 even??? ![[Think]](images/smiles/eusa_think.gif "Think") ![[scratch]](images/smiles/icon_scratch.gif "scratch")
Red_Turbo
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steve b
Premium Member
Joined: 18 Dec 2004
Posts: 3335
Location: Trackdays in the South
Feedback Score: 5
1997 Mazda Eunos
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Red_Turbo wrote: | Has anyone fitted an emerald m3dk on an mr2 turbo. i had one of these ecu's a while back but never got round to fitting it to my last car and sold it cheap im sure that had a 32bit unit in it. all the graphs and options on the computer looked impressive for it. ive heard it compared to the motec as its meant to be similar but not sure what capabilities it has or if it can be used on an mr2 even???
Red_Turbo |
i've got my mazda booked in for fitting & mapping with Dave Walker in January. Only thing it lacks is knock sensor as davebelieves if its mapped properly then you don't get knock. Otherwise its comparable to the Motec, uses the same chip is 32 bit, table is different to motec being 32x16. Its suppose to be very good apparently a lot of Cerbera owners ditch the TVR ecu for this almost straight away. Other plus point is it is cheap.
As for toyota fitment someone would have to call him up, generally it uses a crank position sensor...
Last edited by steve b on Wed Oct 04, 2006 12:59 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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matt_mr2t
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Joined: 19 Jul 2005
Posts: 24621
Location: Essex
Feedback Score: 4
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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Another thing to throw into the mixer. Seems to me like finding people with the ability to map a PFC is difficult at best.
How many people are capable of doing a Motec?
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Doesn't own an MR2 or even a Japanese car anymore, but stayed around as IMOC is too good to leave
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V8Killer
Premium Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1743
Feedback Score: 15
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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| matt_mr2t wrote: | | How many people are capable of doing a Motec? |
Adrian SMith
Dave Rowe
Fraser McKeller
Steve Simpson
Sam Ellassar
To name a few off the top of my head! ![[Very Happy]](images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif "Very Happy")
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Quigonjay
Premium Member
Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Posts: 10581
Location: Blackburn
Feedback Score: 22
1994 Toyota MR2 Mk2 Turbo Rev3
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 1:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Troubled wrote: | http://www.nengun.com/catalogue/product/1
remember to add shipping VAT and Import duty |
if you search for products for your car it will give you a delivered pice and then he will mark it as gift if you wish - never heard of anyone having to pay duty on stuff ordered from nengun
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matt_mr2t
Premium Member
Joined: 19 Jul 2005
Posts: 24621
Location: Essex
Feedback Score: 4
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 2:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Those names mean nothing to me, where are they based?
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ENSMR2
Premium Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 12111
Feedback Score: 1
1994 Toyota MR2 Mk2 Turbo Rev3
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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| matt_mr2t wrote: | | Those names mean nothing to me, where are they based? |
Adrian SMith - FENSPORT (owner)
Dave Rowe - MOTEC
Fraser McKeller - MOTEC
They forgot Tweenierob off that list though who can map motec's.
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Parts For Sale: KAAZ diff:http://www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=115584 HKS Fuel Rail:http://www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=115585 50mm Wastegate:http://www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=115586
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V8Killer
Premium Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1743
Feedback Score: 15
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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| matt_mr2t wrote: | | Those names mean nothing to me, where are they based? |
Steve Simpson and Sam Ellassar are freelance
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matt_mr2t
Premium Member
Joined: 19 Jul 2005
Posts: 24621
Location: Essex
Feedback Score: 4
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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Seems to me like both are hard to find mappers for but looks like the PFC is more wide spread.
I know some people would but I personally wouldnt drive half the legnth of the country for a map.
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V8Killer
Premium Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 1743
Feedback Score: 15
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 2:51 pm Post subject: |
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| matt_mr2t wrote: | | Seems to me like both are hard to find mappers for but looks like the PFC is more wide spread. |
No...there not. There a mobile phone call away
Like i said thats only a handful, i can easily name you about another 15 good mappers of the Motec!
| matt_mr2t wrote: | | I know some people would but I personally wouldnt drive half the legnth of the country for a map. |
Most mappers nowadays come to you. Infact if you checkout Motec Europe, you'd probably realise there is an official Motec dealer near you
Last edited by V8Killer on Wed Oct 04, 2006 2:56 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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ENSMR2
Premium Member
Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 12111
Feedback Score: 1
1994 Toyota MR2 Mk2 Turbo Rev3
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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| matt_mr2t wrote: | Seems to me like both are hard to find mappers for but looks like the PFC is more wide spread.
I know some people would but I personally wouldnt drive half the legnth of the country for a map. |
Where are you based?
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Quigonjay
Premium Member
Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Posts: 10581
Location: Blackburn
Feedback Score: 22
1994 Toyota MR2 Mk2 Turbo Rev3
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 3:02 pm Post subject: |
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| V8Killer wrote: | | Infact if you checkout Motec Europe, you'd probably realise there is an official Motec dealer near you |
no one near me then
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JUIC'IN
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Posts: 1023
Feedback Score: 0
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Mikejc wrote: | Hi guys
I guess I can only tell you that I have run both the PFC and the Motec and offer you my personal views on the subject
The power fc is a capable unit and great value also. But is it anywhere near as good as the Motec, not even close i'm sorry to report. Regardless of who the mappers are you have to remember that the Motec unit makes the PFC look like a toy by comparison It offers so much more than the launch control, anti lag, flat shifting etc that some have mentioned. It allows it's tuner access to advanced 3D mapping features that the PFC could only dream of.
Since fitting the Motec I really can't believe just how much I was missing out on. Despite the fact that the car is now likely to be running 500+bhp, it drives so much better both on and off boost than the PFC was able to offer. I can't believe just how good my car is now on fuel also, soooo much cheaper
Some have giggled about the fact that Dave Rowe only charges £50 an hour. If you were to use him via Motec UK you would pay a great deal more yes, but I think this reflects more on just how nice a guy Dave is by not over charging his personal clients Baring in mind that he wont privately map for any old joe bloggs, he is selective.
Another thing I feel justifies the Motec is the fact that Dave mapped my car from scratch inside an hour Doesn't take long to figure out how much money will be saved in mapping! I easily spent 3 or 4 times what the PFC originally cost me in mapping alone
Having said all of this I believe it's important to add that the final decision rests to a large extent on just how far you want to go. If your happy to stay around the 300+bhp mark then the PFC I believe suits your needs. If you wish to go further and wont the most from your set up, it's Motec all the way
I hope this is useful in making your decision. I have run both and can pass on to you what I have personally learned first hand.
One last thing, I would bet money that the Motec would pull more and safer power out of a car previously fitted with the PFC. It only stands to reason when you think that you have a superior ECU and access to the very best mappers for the unit
Mikejc |
Yeah but you dont get a little commander to sit in a halfords phone holder with the motec thou!...... case closed! ![[tongue]](images/smiles/jef_icon_tongue.gif "tongue")
.............. ![[Gay Fight]](images/smiles/icon_gayfight.gif "Gay Fight")
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AM TUNING
Joined: 14 Dec 2004
Posts: 641
Location: aka andi , hastings
Feedback Score: 0
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| Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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i swore never to post again on here due to reasons i wont go into ,but this once i will
motec and a power fc in country are a world apart,
the power fc is a dam good budget ecu that can do lots ,but
the motec m4 is by far the best ecu ive ever come across ever, this is also due to the mapping by dave and customer support from motec uk ,
its like others before me in this thread , its down to support in the uk and mapping , plenty can map the power fc but who in the uk can fix it when it goes wrong?????
ive came across this when updateing my motec and my laptop battery went flat half way through the update and wiped my motec so it wouldnt even talk the the laptop, dave stayed at the office late to allow me to drive 200 miles that night to get it fixed for the rolling road that weekend ,
i call that dam good service
also adding to this a power fc is a ecu that will only ever fit the car its intended for , a m4 will fit and run 95% off the cars in the world ,
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